How to prove it wasnt my fault..?

EgoXR · 14-02-2009, 07:59 PM

During this week I drove my ute up somebodys rear. Through no fault of my own. Was a little hilux ute, with an aluminum tray.

It was on Canterbury Rd just over blackburn rd, it goes from three lanes into two. I was merging from the left lane into the next, when this bloke was behind my car. the traffic in front of us was slowing down as was I.
I was indicating and was clearly halfway into the next lane, Then the same guy that was behind me darted around me in the next lane, then pulled in front of me, when clearly there was no room, and slammed on his brakes to avoid hitting the traffic infront which was now stationary. Now at the point of impact, he was half in my lane and half in the lane next to mine, hence me only having damage to my FRHS.

I dont have a witness, so its my word against his. When we pulled over he basically wrote down his details in his car, got out after a while, rudely and abruptly asked for mine, got in his car and drove off. It seemed as though he had done all this many times. it was his works car.
I was a bit gobsmacked by his reaction and didnt check the details he gave me, which excluded and insurance company and a rego. I spoke to police who gave me his rego and works phone number, they also said I was in the right.
Without a witness how can i prove that he is in the wrong?

Heres some pics i took before. The damage is in excess of 2k

pertuan · 14-02-2009, 08:08 PM

Perhaps the police report will show that you were in the right?

Off topic, I hate idiots to cut into my lane when clearly there's no room for them let alone yourself!

EgoXR · 14-02-2009, 08:18 PM

[QUOTE=pertuan]Perhaps the police report will show that you were in the right?
QUOTE]

When I was in the cop shop he didnt give me a report..:togo:

DoreSlamR · 14-02-2009, 08:24 PM

[QUOTE=EgoXR]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pertuan

Perhaps the police report will show that you were in the right?
QUOTE]

When I was in the cop shop he didnt give me a report..:togo:

If you want any chance to prove you were not in the wrong you have to give the police a report straight away.

Even before you call your insurance company because they will want a police report number.

Yaw · 14-02-2009, 09:03 PM

where was the damage on his car?
A lot will come down to damage points.
and also on the line markings of the road.
Any police report will not prove anything, the police did not witness it.
As an insurance officer I would be looking firstly at a satelite picture of where you say it happened, I would look at where his damage was.
But from what you have described in your verison I would be of the opinion you will be at fault.
Facts I know thus far from what you have said :
"I drove my ute up somebodys rear."- this leads me to believe his damage is to his rear.
"I was indicating and was clearly halfway into the next lane"
Leads me to believe you may have been either doing a shoulder check or looking in the rear view mirror.
"Then the same guy that was behind me darted around me in the next lane, then pulled in front of me"

For what you are claiming to be not at fault damage would need to be down his left side starting from before the back of the car. As he was in front of you when you changed lanes shows he was there before you.

Sorry but without an INDEPENDANT witness you will most likley be the at fault party.

EgoXR · 15-02-2009, 01:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yaw

. As he was in front of you when you changed lanes shows he was there before you.

Sorry but without an INDEPENDANT witness you will most likley be the at fault party.

Nah I was in front of him when i changed lanes. He then sped around me and jumped on the brakes.

**fordomatic** · 14-02-2009, 08:09 PM

mate from my experience unless you have a witness you will be paying. only because its rear end and they will say you should have left more room, even though you obviously could'nt.

motorcycles4eva · 14-02-2009, 08:11 PM

doesn't the damage show with your story?? its towards the right corner..if you rammed him then it would be your whole front end..

alter_EGOXR · 14-02-2009, 09:05 PM

sorry to hear mate...bt may i ask how old u r? here in nsw, if ur p-plater its usually ur fault no matter how u look at it, unless u have a witness....my mum (whose got a full licence) got into a bingle early last year and it was clearly not her fault even when the accident occured the guy who ran into her, took full responsibility for the accident...bt when it came to telling the insurance company he decided to tell a lil fib..newyz long story short u need a witness or even a police report because those so called "accident repair experts" dont know any better...just keep fighting mate and you should be alrite (took us nearly 6months before we got the car repaired)...good luck!

Alanbxr8 · 14-02-2009, 09:23 PM

Same thing happened to me years ago, a Taxi pulled in front & stopped dead, the Police did understand what happened but without a witness I still copped a neg driving ticket

EgoXR · 15-02-2009, 01:41 AM

[QUOTE=hemank]sorry to hear mate...bt may i ask how old u r? [QUOTE]

Im 23, so couple years off my p's. never been in an accident before.

Redrum · 15-02-2009, 02:31 AM

In Victoria when you report accidents we do not give you a report. They are done on a data base which only accidents records, located at the VIctoria Police Centre, can access hard copies, at a cost I think.

In an accident like this, if there are no witnesses, most likely police will not be able to work out who is at fault, unless the other party admits fault or corroborates your story. Due to the fact that the damage is on the front of your vehicle the other party could easily make claims you failed to give way whilst merging and hit him. so I would think, if the other party does not admit fault, the accident will be written off as unable to ascertain who is at fault and if any offences took place. The matter then goes to the civil arena, where the burden of proof changes. I would say Insurance will be fighting this one out.

wodahs · 14-02-2009, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EgoXR

During this week I drove my ute up somebodys rear. Through no fault of my own. Was a little hilux ute, with an aluminum tray.

It was on Canterbury Rd just over blackburn rd, it goes from three lanes into two. I was merging from the left lane into the next, when this bloke was behind my car. the traffic in front of us was slowing down as was I.
I was indicating and was clearly halfway into the next lane, Then the same guy that was behind me darted around me in the next lane, then pulled in front of me, when clearly there was no room, and slammed on his brakes to avoid hitting the traffic infront which was now stationary. Now at the point of impact, he was half in my lane and half in the lane next to mine, hence me only having damage to my FRHS.

I dont have a witness, so its my word against his. When we pulled over he basically wrote down his details in his car, got out after a while, rudely and abruptly asked for mine, got in his car and drove off. It seemed as though he had done all this many times. it was his works car.
I was a bit gobsmacked by his reaction and didnt check the details he gave me, which excluded and insurance company and a rego. I spoke to police who gave me his rego and works phone number, they also said I was in the right.
Without a witness how can i prove that he is in the wrong?

Heres some pics i took before. The damage is in excess of 2k

had drivers do this to me aswell
you try to stop a 80 tonne truck when they do this and then they get out and recon they are all justified

last fairlane · 14-02-2009, 10:41 PM

I know what you mean Wadah
45 tonne and I cop this crap at least once a day in the suburbs will they ever learn it should be taught to car drivers that big rigs need more room to stop especially at lights you are pulling up at a red light and some one ducks in front and the heart goes into your mouth 80 tonne that would be to stressful
80 tonne that would have to be a road train?
john

**Sorted** · 14-02-2009, 11:02 PM

If you haven't got a witness to back up your story then your going find it very hard to prove the other person was at fault..........

Fev · 14-02-2009, 11:25 PM

silly impatient bastard.. they will always cause this sort of thing and of course, the person who didnt do anything wrong cops it..

i hope he pays for it.

Rodp · 15-02-2009, 09:27 AM

My father was spun off the road on a 2 lane 110kph freeway when a car overtook him in the right lane, merged suddenly clipping the front of my father's car with the rear of his car and put him into a barrier.

My father was charged with neg driving and his insurance was liable for 100% of the damages to both cars.

Unless you have a witness, I'd say you're going to be SOL. It'll come down to your word vs his and the law tends to favour the car infront.

**ebxr8240** · 15-02-2009, 11:49 AM

Good luck !!

GS608 · 15-02-2009, 03:31 PM

so basically you were already in the lane you were merging into, he was in the far right lane and then darted infront of you to stop in the middle of the road? where you hit him?

how are there not any witnesses? surely the traffic infront would have seen it, and maybe people behind if there were any..

ryanstev · 15-02-2009, 03:44 PM

I'd say there's only one way to fight this and that's to lie.

Find a friend who will say they witnessed the accident. The friend doesn't need to make a police statement, if it gets that far, then they can back down and say they aren't sure, so no law is broken. It may be enough to make the other driver back down and tell the truth.

Too many people get taken advantage of because they do the honest thing and admit they don't have a witness and the other person does the dishonest thing and lies.

Rodp · 15-02-2009, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ryanstev

Find a friend who will say they witnessed the accident. The friend doesn't need to make a police statement, if it gets that far, then they can back down and say they aren't sure, so no law is broken. It may be enough to make the other driver back down and tell the truth.

If that's not breaking the law then it certainly would be classified as bending it so far that it'll inevitably break. I doubt it would be looked too kindly upon. Police aren't naieve.

ryanstev · 15-02-2009, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodp

If that's not breaking the law then it certainly would be classified as bending it so far that it'll inevitably break. I doubt it would be looked too kindly upon. Police aren't naieve.

What I meant is you tell the other guy you have a witness, if he calls your bluff you back down. You wouldn't tell the Police this or your insurance.

Yaw · 15-02-2009, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ryanstev

I'd say there's only one way to fight this and that's to lie.

Find a friend who will say they witnessed the accident. The friend doesn't need to make a police statement, if it gets that far, then they can back down and say they aren't sure, so no law is broken. It may be enough to make the other driver back down and tell the truth.

Too many people get taken advantage of because they do the honest thing and admit they don't have a witness and the other person does the dishonest thing and lies.

Thats also called insurance fraud.

I am sorry, I do understand exactly what you are saying,
You said you were half way in the next lane you were merging into- you MUST give way. Even if he cut in front of you he was there before you were clearly evidenced as the fact you hit his rear. If he was in the same lane you were and then went around you, he made it there before you, if he was in the lane beside you and behind and then sped up and stopped, it was his lane to start with and you have failed to give him way, if he was comming from the far right lane into the middle lane (the one you were merging into from the left, it will end up both are at fault as both were merging into the same lane. but no matter wich way it goes you will need to pay your excess and if you refuse to pay it, it will just mean your repairs will be delayed until it is paid or if they go ahead with the repairs and when they are complete the panel repairer will not release the car to you until they are paid.

I really do feel sorry for you, I am just trying to explain what will happen, and I am basing this on what you have told us here, not what the other person has said.
I do work in motor claims.

ryanstev · 15-02-2009, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yaw

Thats also called insurance fraud.
I do work in motor claims.

Well I won't argue with you since this is your job, but I wouldn't have thought it would be fraud to tell the other guy that so he's scared into telling the truth.
I didn't mean telling the insurance or the Police this.

GS608 · 15-02-2009, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ryanstev

Well I won't argue with you since this is your job, but I wouldn't have thought it would be fraud to tell the other guy that so he's scared into telling the truth.
I didn't mean telling the insurance or the Police this.

he will most likely say, alright get him to write a witness statement at the police station or some crap

ILLaViTaR · 15-02-2009, 04:49 PM

Why isn't anyone saying this about the other guy?

"We must drive in a way to avoid a collision".

A guy cutting in front of him last minute coming to a stop is far more reckless and accident prone than than not slowing down when someone is next to you in most situations you wouldn't. A lot of you are being unrealistic, how many times do you merge in peak hour with cars next to you? Should we just decide to sit at the end of the merging lane and wait 5 hours until the entire lane is free?

gtxb67 · 15-02-2009, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ILLaViTaR

Why isn't anyone saying this about the other guy?

"We must drive in a way to avoid a collision".

simply because he doesn't seem to be on the forums, and because he has not asked any questions about apportioning blame

it seems no one from here saw the accident - therefore no one can say who is right or wrong. a lot have put a likely case that EgoXR will be considered to be at fault, simply because if you take out emotion, and have no witness accounts, it is almost guaranteed that he will get the bill

hopefully at the very least, he and others will learn something. that is not suggesting he is wrong, but maybe doing something tiny different will make a difference next time. when i was only 3 months into my license, a guy and i were both heading in the same direction into a roundabout. he was turning right from the left lane (illegal) and i was going straight through in the right lane (legal). he pulled accross and i tapped him. i was not at fault, but i have nearly always made sure not to go two abreast into roundabouts again. even if i was not at fault, there was something i could learn. hopefully if there is something for EgoXR to learn, he will too and become a better driver for it

the fact is, this world is full of morons and to blame them when something goes wrong is a waste of time and sometimes hypocrytical. if we can somehow allow for the fact that others are stupid, we can give ourselves the best chance of survival on the road and in general. it does not matter who is right or wrong, just whether we all win or lose

Rodp · 15-02-2009, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ILLaViTaR

Why isn't anyone saying this about the other guy?

"We must drive in a way to avoid a collision".

A guy cutting in front of him last minute coming to a stop is far more reckless and accident prone than than not slowing down when someone is next to you in most situations you wouldn't. A lot of you are being unrealistic, how many times do you merge in peak hour with cars next to you? Should we just decide to sit at the end of the merging lane and wait 5 hours until the entire lane is free?

Unrealistic in what way?

I don't see many posts suggesting he is at fault, rather that he doesn't have the onus of proof on his side that he isn't at fault. That's all that matters in this instance.

mik · 15-02-2009, 05:13 PM

this exact thing happened to my brother , he ended up paying for the lot :(.

**aussiblue** · 15-02-2009, 05:13 PM

Quote:

..I will fight this to the death as I had right of way.

Unfortunately, I think the vehicle in front and to the right of you will be deemed to have right of way however it got there especially as you hit him rather than he hitting you.