Can Holden do anything wrong

drw009 · 02-06-2009, 07:33 PM

Never ceases to amaze me. I get home from work hoping to catch up on the info on the GM collapse, and stupidly expecting to see a positive spin from Ford to take advantage of a should be weaker opponent. But every single web page has a positive spin on how GM and Holden will pull out of this better than before.

1. Who the hell is Holdens PR guy and why cant Ford have them

2 Why is it that the hard working companies not asking for billions will be the big loser in all this while the company already borrowing billions start clean slate.

GTP290 · 02-06-2009, 07:39 PM

I agree whole heartidly, the manager at my work is excited about getting a Holden Cruze as his next company car, he said he couldnt care less about GMs financial state, just aslong as he gets his new Holden car, hes happy!

phillyc · 02-06-2009, 07:56 PM

My concern is that they will also get the sympathy purchases as well. I don't want them to disappear, but equally i want Ford to get their deserved leg up out of this. Doesn't look that way.

**ebxr8240** · 02-06-2009, 07:59 PM

figjam comes to mind here..

R-Design · 02-06-2009, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTP290

I agree whole heartidly, the manager at my work is excited about getting a Holden Cruze as his next company car, he said he couldnt care less about GMs financial state, just aslong as he gets his new Holden car, hes happy!

Your boss sounds like a loser.

Don't be disheartened boys, just because the media don't report it doesn't mean it's not happening. It will all unravel for GMH in the coming months and no amount of positive spin will be able to save them.

I don't mean to bash GMH as I know a number of good people associated with the company, but it is what it is.

Besides, I think we’d all prefer to see Ford outsell Holden based on a better product range rather than GM falling on its sword.

jabba · 04-06-2009, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTP290

I agree whole heartidly, the manager at my work is excited about getting a Holden Cruze as his next company car, he said he couldnt care less about GMs financial state, just aslong as he gets his new Holden car, hes happy!

Excited about a Cruze..

Your boss is a poofter...

drw009 · 02-06-2009, 08:00 PM

Could you imagine the table turned and it was ford posting bankruptcy, every paper in Aus, every news show, every website saying its over for ford and that is has been coming for years blah blah blah,

the positive spin Holden always creates is what gets to me the most where Ford just has twiddling thumbs waiting for their turn.

Iggypoppin' · 02-06-2009, 08:05 PM

Sorry to say this, but guys wake up...its an originally AUSTRALIAN company, why would they want to be negative about it? yeah they could, yeah GM screwed up bigtime and get a "get out of jail free" card, but by the sounds of it, everyone would like holden to fail?? i don't. without holden, SA goes belly up. along with the several thousand employees in other states, dealerships etc. that, and without holden, we have no-one to rag on. and why speculate on what has not happened in regards to Ford going bankrupt, and everyone saying "we told you so?". we haven't gone bankrupt, probably won't, and can take quiet satisfaction in the fact we are doing the best out of this. Ford have terrible marketing, we all know it. nothing we can do but continue to support them ourselves. if they dont make the most of "opportunities" like these, well, thats their headsup, not ours.

drw009 · 02-06-2009, 08:09 PM

I dont want Holden to fail at all, too many jobs , too strong an aussie history , and is like a yin yang to ford. they both feed off each other, im just hoping ford US and aus claw back some market share out of this thats all, and..... that all important public perception and brand image

GTENVY · 02-06-2009, 10:52 PM

[QUOTE=NJXR6]Sorry to say this, but guys wake up...its an originally AUSTRALIAN company

Well Sorry to say it has never been Australian owned from the time it produced its first car. When it was Australian owed it was assembling bodies for Ford, Chrysler and GM. GM Brought them, then they started making there own cars under the new parent company GMH.

imugli · 03-06-2009, 08:48 AM

[QUOTE=GTENVY]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NJXR6

Sorry to say this, but guys wake up...its an originally AUSTRALIAN company

Well Sorry to say it has never been Australian owned from the time it produced its first car. When it was Australian owed it was assembling bodies for Ford, Chrysler and GM. GM Brought them, then they started making there own cars under the new parent company GMH.

He shoots, he scores!

:

dallasv8 · 03-06-2009, 10:22 AM

[QUOTE=GTENVY]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NJXR6

Sorry to say this, but guys wake up...its an originally AUSTRALIAN company

Well Sorry to say it has never been Australian owned from the time it produced its first car. When it was Australian owed it was assembling bodies for Ford, Chrysler and GM. GM Brought them, then they started making there own cars under the new parent company GMH.

haha,you dont see that advertised in the holden meat pie ads

i would like to see ford come out on top,especially since they seem to be doing the right things to keep themselves going.

i just hope that since the usa government is pulling them out of the crapper, that they dont just use gm cars as the main fleet car over there,or here for that matter.

**kypez** · 03-06-2009, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dallasv8

haha,you dont see that advertised in the holden meat pie ads

i would like to see ford come out on top,especially since they seem to be doing the right things to keep themselves going.

i just hope that since the usa government is pulling them out of the crapper, that they dont just use gm cars as the main fleet car over there,or here for that matter.

I think Ford and other car makers would have a good case for an Anti-Trust case against the US govt if they did that...

The Yeti · 04-06-2009, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NJXR6

Sorry to say this, but guys wake up...its an originally AUSTRALIAN company, why would they want to be negative about it? yeah they could, yeah GM screwed up bigtime and get a "get out of jail free" card, but by the sounds of it, everyone would like holden to fail?? i don't. without holden, SA goes belly up. along with the several thousand employees in other states, dealerships etc. that, and without holden, we have no-one to rag on. and why speculate on what has not happened in regards to Ford going bankrupt, and everyone saying "we told you so?". we haven't gone bankrupt, probably won't, and can take quiet satisfaction in the fact we are doing the best out of this. Ford have terrible marketing, we all know it. nothing we can do but continue to support them ourselves. if they dont make the most of "opportunities" like these, well, thats their headsup, not ours.

zactly, holden have been arround as an Australian company LONG befor it was General Motors Holden.

GM in the US going bust is a bad thing for all conserned what we need ot d oin Austrila however is make sure it doesnt happen here, Holden Ford Toyota who cares, the fact is while there being made here and we're buying them here ita all good for US.

Now more than ever its time to think local

XR_Strider_GuY · 02-06-2009, 08:17 PM

Guys,

As strange as this sounds, we (Ford enthusiasts) need Holden to survive to keep our Falcon alive and keep the competition alive. We all benefit as a result. Alot of parts suppliers (PBR comes to mind) locally supply to both brands. If one goes I would think it will not be viable to just supply 1 brand without significant cost increase. Who wants an XR8 to be worth $70k???

Windsor220 · 02-06-2009, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drw009

2 Why is it that the hard working companies not asking for billions will be the big loser in all this while the company already borrowing billions start clean slate.

Thats just life. Hard working people seem to get nowhere while others wing there way through.

One thing that annoys me is that Obama said GM will rise again and be on top. Bit unfair for other car manufacturers when they are doing it off their own back.

timmo · 02-06-2009, 08:49 PM

Of course Obama would say that after the US Taxpayer has invested $30 billion in GM. Why would he say any different?
As far as Holden is concerned, they produce one of the best value for money cars in the world, which pushes Ford to make a better car than what they would without a direct competitor.

GT69 · 02-06-2009, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by timmo

Of course Obama would say that after the US Taxpayer has invested $30 billion in GM. Why would he say any different?
As far as Holden is concerned, they produce one of the best value for money cars in the world, which pushes Ford to make a better car than what they would without a direct competitor.

Your looking at this one eyed. Push the falcon against a BMW M5. Why not? Up the quality, people have already shown the $150,000 for a BMW isn't asking to much? Look at it this way, ever thought it possible that Holden is holding Ford back? Just a thought

:

LowEL2XR8 · 02-06-2009, 09:02 PM

Holden PR is second to none. They could sell snow to eskimos.

**DJM83** · 03-06-2009, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LowEL2XR8

Holden PR is second to none. They could sell snow to eskimos.

So very true

timmo · 02-06-2009, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by timmo
Of course Obama would say that after the US Taxpayer has invested $30 billion in GM. Why would he say any different?
As far as Holden is concerned, they produce one of the best value for money cars in the world, which pushes Ford to make a better car than what they would without a direct competitor.

Your looking at this one eyed. Push the falcon against a BMW M5. Why not? Up the quality, people have already shown the $150,000 for a BMW isn't asking to much? Look at it this way, ever thought it possible that Holden is holding Ford back? Just a thought

Not really...I was born and bred Holden, now I drive a Ford. You can't honestly believe that without Holden, Ford's perceived quality will continue to increase to the point where it is comparable to a BMW. It's the reason both GM and Ford continue to buy marquee brands like Aston Martin and Jag. They realise that there are limits to what people will pay for a particular brand

BHDOGS · 02-06-2009, 10:25 PM

I find i amusing that if holden get rid of jobs the government jumps in, it happens anywhere else in another market thats not the car industry and its tough off to center link

deesun · 03-06-2009, 08:52 AM

On this mornings news Ford US has stated a 20% increase in sales in recent months and will ramp up production to cope. They have said " no problems here folks, steady as she goes" onward and upward for Ford.

The Snout · 03-06-2009, 09:37 AM

GM kept the Holden name when they bought them out, what 70 years ago now or something. Toyota is as Australian as Holden or Ford for that matter. All overseas companies that employee Aussies.

I really don't care if Holden die or more likely is bought out by a VW or Skoda. The free market isn't a party being held in anyone's honor. Holden don't deserve to survive just because 'that's how it's always been'.

If they fold then those buyers will just have to buy Falcons/Mondeos or Aurions, or whatever vehicle suits. Life will go on, even without Holden.

Crazed · 03-06-2009, 05:38 PM

Holden deserve the positive spin, look at what is happening to its brothers:

GM has killed Saturn and Pontiac and is selling SAAB, Hummer, Vauxhull, Opel. Whilst GM-DAT (Daewoo) is having huge refinancing issues. Out of all the doom and gloom of the GM world Holden is one of the few bright spots!

Who else in Australia, has the biggest selling car (Commodore),invested in product to bring out a new wagon (Sportwagon), maintained investment in the long wheel-base-market (Statesman). They also build left and right hand drive cars and will be bringing out E85 flex fuel, and direct injection. And with the mess the car industry is in, they still are planning on being profitable (early 2010).

It is amazing that GM which is the largest car maker on the planet, has basically held onto Holden for dear life while jettising some of its largest and well-known marques. Holden have done bloody well out of all this, good on them.

seXCmont · 03-06-2009, 05:42 PM

if holden goes then watching bathurst will get a lot less interesting

mrghia · 04-06-2009, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seXCmont

if holden goes then watching bathurst will get a lot less interesting

it hasnt be that interesting to watch in years. Thay are only Ford and Holden bodys. what happened to the car that they used to drive to the track?

As for the holden Cruse it might be good to try and make more jobs here but for Holden to drop the Astra and replace with this is stupid. The Astra would still have to be the best small car holden have because its not built by Deawoo!

mik · 03-06-2009, 07:35 PM

agreed....that would be the end of bathurst for many i think.

Joshvee · 03-06-2009, 11:49 PM

As someone who isn't a fanatic I just wanted to correct a few errors here,

First of all, Holden Has not gone chapter 11. It's U.S. Parent company has.
Holden Is NOT getting bailed out by the U.S. government. It's U.S. Parent company is.
In fact Holden can very comfortably survive without GM USA. Although Holden is indeed owned by GM USA, it is still a financial business entity all of its own. It has made great profit and has a solid and healthy portfolio.

Secondly, GM is not the largest car manufacturer in the world. Toyota is. In fact Toyota sold more cars in Australia than Ford and GM put together.

And thirdly, technically the US government isn't "bailing GM out" it's buying 60% of GM.

I’m shocked at even the existence of this thread. It shows the immaturity of the average Australian that they can be so blindly biased by a brand name. Holden make GREAT cars and so do Ford. But hey guess what.. Holden also make crappy cars and SO DO FORD. As does every major motor company. (except Skoda.... they only make crappy cars)

:

You all say your Ford fans, well you should use that word carefully. The word Fan comes from Fanatic and the word Fanatic means: fanatic - a person motivated by irrational and illogical enthusiasm.

Your apparent hatred for Holden is both illogical and immature.

zoomie · 04-06-2009, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshvee

As someone who isn't a fanatic I just wanted to correct a few errors here,

First of all, Holden Has not gone chapter 11. It's U.S. Parent company has.
Holden Is NOT getting bailed out by the U.S. government. It's U.S. Parent company is.
In fact Holden can very comfortably survive without GM USA. Although Holden is indeed owned by GM USA, it is still a financial business entity all of its own. It has made great profit and has a solid and healthy portfolio.
Secondly, GM is not the largest car manufacturer in the world. Toyota is. In fact Toyota sold more cars in Australia than Ford and GM put together.

And thirdly, technically the US government isn't "bailing GM out" it's buying 60% of GM.

I’m shocked at even the existence of this thread. It shows the immaturity of the average Australian that they can be so blindly biased by a brand name. Holden make GREAT cars and so do Ford. But hey guess what.. Holden also make crappy cars and SO DO FORD. As does every major motor company. (except Skoda.... they only make crappy cars)

:

You all say your Ford fans, well you should use that word carefully. The word Fan comes from Fanatic and the word Fanatic means: fanatic - a person motivated by irrational and illogical enthusiasm.

Your apparent hatred for Holden is both illogical and immature.

Holden hasnt made a single cent of "profit" since release of the VE commondore despite all its so called sales success, I mean hell look at how much they will knock of the price of a new commodore without even having to haggle with them, so there profit per commodore sold must be at a near all time low at the moment.

Where do you think they got the money to develop the VE? Oh thats right from there "parent" company GM in america. They still havnt payed back that money, thats why losing the Pontiac G8 export to the USA is a killer for them as that was going to be the big part of the repay money for the VE development costs here in australia