Camera Car on a FWY?

Spanrz · 24-02-2010, 05:45 PM

Can someone point out the juristiction on how legal a camera car is, on a FWY?

There was a 10km line of traffic, bumper to bumper doing about 20kph, tonight on the Monash Freeway, all because of 2 camera cars.
People get that scared, that they will set off the camera, they literally stop just before the camera car. (due to the high incidence of supposive speeding cars when they aren't actually speeding).
This created a major stop-start traffic hazard, increasing the risk dramatically, of accidents.

Scenario is 100kph zone, with a good long downhill grade. Though never seen an accident in that area in over 10 years.

I was under the impression was that a camera car can only be placed on a downhill grade in an high accident zone??

Mr Hardware · 24-02-2010, 06:11 PM

This isn't normal for Vic?
It's normal for QLD!

G6ET8U · 24-02-2010, 06:28 PM

They do it all the time on the Metropolitan Ring Road out near Thomastown too. I don't come to work that way anymore (unrelated) but every man and their dog would go past at bloody 80kph in the 100kph zone hoping they wouldn't get flashed. Extremely frustrating.

Spanrz · 24-02-2010, 06:50 PM

Umm, just did some research and finally found a current document.

http://www.justice.vic.gov.au/wps/wc...oc?MOD=AJPERES

Quite interestingly it quite clearly states the following :

Peak Traffic Periods

Mobile speed cameras as a general rule should not be used during peak traffic periods, particularly in the inner Metropolitan area. It is a waste of an expensive resource (and generates criticism and ridicule) to operate a speed camera during peak periods when traffic volumes reduce the traffic flow to speeds lower that the posted limit.

In some extenuating circumstances, camera operation in this traffic period may be necessary. This will need to be validated by the Regional Traffic Inspector.

In my view, reading that document, quite clearly the camera operators infringed upon "Criteria 2" and "Criteria 3"
Quite particularly, "traffic flow" is mentioned by means that camera operation should not affect traffic flow.
Not only that, they were within 300 metres of the "bottom" of the gradient.

Wondered who got flashed, I know I'd be fighting it, as their spot was in contravention of their rules.
But considering it, they wouldn't have gotten anyone, as everyone was doing 20kph past them...jeez.

The G6ET Spot · 24-02-2010, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spanrz

In my view, reading that document, quite clearly the camera operators infringed upon "Criteria 2" and "Criteria 3"
Quite particularly, "traffic flow" is mentioned by means that camera operation should not affect traffic flow.
Not only that, they were within 300 metres of the "bottom" of the gradient.

I think you should go back and read the article again, as they were not the ones interrupting the traffic flow. but as you said yourself in the 1st post it was the drivers slowing down,if they did the speed limit there would be no problem.

Secondly you should read the full definition of what is classed as an unsuitable gradient.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spanrz

Wondered who got flashed, I know I'd be fighting it, as their spot was in contravention of their rules.
But considering it, they wouldn't have gotten anyone, as everyone was doing 20kph past them...jeez.

Good luck challenging that.

04redxr8 · 24-02-2010, 07:24 PM

The camera was probably also set contrary the manufacturers guidelines too.

But who could you possibly report it to? :(

**Silver Ghia** · 24-02-2010, 08:14 PM

Its funny also when following cars going along the Citylink, they are going under the speed limit, but have to put their brakelights on and slow down even further when they go under a eTag gantry thinking there's a speed camera there also. GRRRR.

Auslandau · 24-02-2010, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silver Ghia

Its funny also when following cars going along the Citylink, they are going under the speed limit, but have to put their brakelights on and slow down even further when they go under a eTag gantry thinking there's a speed camera there also. GRRRR.

Try driving East Link everyday! Many braking at the gantry's thinking the same then hit Wellington rd where everyone brakes again to 90 ..... Its annoying but more so it is dangerous.

I must admit to doing this too realizing I wasn't watching the speedo but very dangerously watching the traffic wondering if the person next to me with there indicator on "do they know I am here" ... then hitting the overpass, slamming the brakes on, then checking the speedo to see I am actually not speeding!

Don't know if the speed camera on the side of the Freeway is legal or not. I think they think they can park and do what ever ..... but they have fixed ones so I suppose they can? They can be dangerous but along as they are taking pics their happy.

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joolz · 24-02-2010, 08:14 PM

Found this on the Vicroads website. Not sure if cameras are allowed to "park" in the emergency stopping lane but should be well off the freeway.

178 Stopping in an emergency stopping lane
A driver (except the rider of a bicycle) must not
stop in an emergency stopping lane unless the
condition of the driver, a passenger or the driver's
vehicle, or any other factor, makes it necessary or
desirable for the driver to stop in the emergency
stopping lane in the interests of safety, and the
driver stops for no longer than is necessary in the
circumstances.
Penalty: 2 penalty units.
Note
Bicycle and driver's vehicle are defined in the dictionary,
and emergency stopping lane is defined in rule 95.
r. 178

Den76 · 25-02-2010, 08:30 AM

Where abouts on the monash fwy were they sitting and what time?

Pinkbits · 25-02-2010, 11:24 AM

They are regularly set up outbound between Princes Hwy & Pound Rd.

**GasoLane** · 25-02-2010, 01:43 PM

I think you'll find they can set up where they like and when they like. All in the name of "carrying out their duty"

As for the "Mobile speed cameras as a general rule should not be used during peak traffic periods" the operative words here are "General rule" and "should not"

There's nothing to say that they are not allowed by law.

fangq · 25-02-2010, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GasOLane

I think you'll find they can set up where they like and when they like. All in the name of "carrying out their duty"

As for the "Mobile speed cameras as a general rule should not be used during peak traffic periods" the operative words here are "General rule" and "should not"

There's nothing to say that they are not allowed by law.

Err, no they can't ; there are very specific guidelines that they have to follow.
Too bad manual of procedures for camera use ( MOP, SOP ), and lidar for that matter, are not in the public domain. I've seen plenty of instances where egregious breaches of guidelines have occurred.

Steve

Bobman · 25-02-2010, 07:31 PM

Common sight on Frankston Freeway.

They're just asking to be hit by a wayward truck!

**Mechan1k** · 26-02-2010, 12:25 AM

See ... that's the problem. No one in the public get to see the Manual of Procedure (if there is such a thing).

So how does it get policed ... it doesn't ... so in the end ... it comes down to as GasOLane mentioned ... it's not actual law we can chase up on. So in the end, camera cars can be set up anywhere ... literally.

If you are not speeding ... you have no need to be worried. I realise some people over-react and hit the anchors all the time ... but it also comes down to be a driver ... and watching out for everyone else on the road.

As for a camera car being on the freeway ... used to be a common sight all of the time ... luckily NSW haven't really used them in a while.

Not sure why they have them in Vic ... there's a fixed speed camera every 1km anyway.

XWGT · 26-02-2010, 08:45 AM

I think this was Tuesday around 5pm because I was stuck in that traffic and absolutely COULD NOT BELIEVE HOW STUPID people were acting.

yes 2 speed cameras (one parked right behind the other so I doubt they were operational) and everyone was doing LESS THAN 20 KPH past them! WTF for people its a godd damn freeway!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!???????????????????????????? ????????????

The bank up of traffic was easily 5 klms as it started before Stud Rd and the cameras were down near Pound Rd.

I truly despair for the level of brains the current Australian community possess. I truly do.

Spanrz · 28-02-2010, 10:12 AM

In the above post I put a link to the current document.
I just like to ask a few questions about the documents guidlines and why they infringed upon them.
If they do it all the time (infringe), then why make the document up in the first place.

I can honestly say, if anyone has driven in the USA at all, they would know how well the flow moves, even in peak hour the traffic moves.
Melbourne, with a population of less than NYC has major traffic issues more than NYC. What is with that?