Police Powers And Your Rights, What You Need to Know!!! - Page 2

Psycho Chicken · 24-12-2005, 12:31 PM

I'm not even gonna bother reading that. So what, you know your rights. There is ALWAYS something up a copper's sleve. Be a smartarse to a hard cop and he'll just do you over twice as hard.

I've been caught doing stupid things and never had anything more than a lighter wallet and a few more demerit points, even though the coppers could of absolutely stuffed me. One even said he could of sent me to court if he wanted to.

The way I see it, you've got two choices; respect the cop and admit you've stuffed up, get off fairly lightly or act like a smartarse trying to list every single one of your rights, only to have the copper throw a much heavier book right back at you. Yes there are ***** coppers around. Cop it on the chin and go talk to his sergeant later on, assuming you haven't been sprung doing something dumb.

Walkinshaw · 24-12-2005, 01:07 PM

I'm gonna agree with rob here. Im NOT a road saint, however in my time ive paid less than $300 in fines and lost 2points, however im sure i could have been done for MUCH MUCH more (and have no vehicle as a result). So 5 steps to keeping your nose clean when you do get in trouble.

(1) Smile
(2) Be polite
(3) Do everything they ask for
(4) Thank them
(5) Smile

clontarf_x · 24-12-2005, 01:18 PM

Yeah, same as pretty much everyone has said. Just remember they trained and have been Police Officers for longer than you were at school. They know their stuff and they hardly want to make their job harder by "picking on people".

If they see you doing wrong, your gone. If you act like a smart ***, your heading towards gone. If you just talk with them like a normal person, chances are they will appreciate it and probably let you off (if its a minor thing). I had it happen to me last night.

I was getting Subway, came up to an RBT and shat myself (unregistered vehicle, freakin stupid stamp duty caught me out :() Parked on the side of the road and thought about doing a runner.... that was until some other guy took my idea one step further and did it. He parked, turned lights off, got out fo car and run across the road (we were both 100M from the RBT) and next thing you know two Highway Patrol cars and screaming down either side of the mdeian strip and smacked him down good. So all I did was drove up to the RBT, the nice lady saw I had an invalid rego sticker, so she asked me to park on the verge just up the raod and shed be with me soon. So I did. I parked there, and patiently waited 5 minutes for her. She came up and asked whats up, and I told her I lived just round the corner (truth) and were just out to get dinner (truth) and that usually I get permits for long trips (truth) but because we were just getting dinner I didnt think it would be necesary. The lady didn't know what permit was so I just expained it to her politely. She was much impressed, told me I was a top bloke and let me go. All you gotta do peoples is be polite, and respect them

chief · 25-12-2005, 08:37 PM

Thanks for the info. It is good info to have, but there will be something up a coppers sleeve. If you think they cant do something for X reason. They will probably do it for Y reason. Just be polite and if you did wrong cop it on the chin.

GenesiS · 25-12-2005, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wicked

120 on a highway zoned 100 with no traffic or houses in the vicinity late at night does not constitute a fine imho.

To true, it constitutes stupidity and ignorance.

Maybe it would be time to point out that road rules aren't just for others and their property, but also for your own well being, and while your scenario may seem flawless, and i'm sure you'll come up with a thousand reasons why it is, those rules are for your own safety. Want to do 120, 130 hell 180, or 220 go to calder park or eastern creek or a local race track in a controlled enviroment.

So you're on a quiet country road, no houses, no cars, its 3am nothing for miles, except that wombat you didn't see... would 20km/h make a difference? might make a difference between life or death, but at 20km/h less (100) you will have a better chance that's for sure...

I'm no angel, I had a poor habit, and was a slow learner when it came to my speed. Fortunately for me, I learnt before it was to late. Unfortunatly, after watching tonights news, not everyone seems to learn this lesson so soon or for that matter actually survives to learn it.

Speed cameras are b/s, you'll fine the average police officer agrees with that too. But speeding, 120 in 100 no matter where or when, you deserve it.

:

ED Classic · 26-12-2005, 12:28 AM

I agree with XA Coupe..Know your rights and responsibilities. Thankfully the law is designed to prosecute idiots but its also handy for you to know if your bluff is being called.

TuMor · 26-12-2005, 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RED_EL_XR8

Don't be and act like a toss-pot in public and on public roads!

Don't be the idiot whose stupidity and idiotic acts shine above the stupidity of others in a sea of idiots!

Don't associate and congregate with idiots in the pursuance of idiotic behavior!

Consider the value of fitting that "book me" accessory or those illegal mods, (particularly those mods that serve no value for performance or handling and serve no purpose other than to impress the wearers of ill fitting trousers.)

If pulled over, consider before blurting out terms like "Harassment" and a plethora of swine and farmyard related insults, what harassment actually entails!

Before playing bush lawyer consider for at least a moment, that for you law is a part time pursuit and you are taking on a professional that does this stuff for a living (as well as pulling fools that knew better out of trashed vehicles and delivering news to their relatives) , so odds on the guy in the uniform knows more angles than you have ever dreamed of, and knows all the "get out of gaol" free clauses.

I've held a drivers license longer than many reader here have been on the planet, and in nearly 30 years can only recall one booking that I'd consider was unfair amongst numerous bookings.

Powers to search vehicles etc will fall under many acts and provisions from many areas of law, to follow or rely on interpretations of one set of laws is foolhardy indeed.

You do have to exit a vehicle when requested, failing to do so after a police officer has adequately identified them-self is defying a reasonable request from a police officer and entitles you to be apprehended.

Ever wondered why some people are driving away in minutes and others are detained on the roadside for an eternity? Guess which ones copped the ticket or warnings, and which ones were lippy and playing the "I know my rights card".

It's hardly rocket science and it doesn't take numerous incorrect or ill advised legal interpretations to work out!

Somebody give this man a trophy, its the best advice ever...
Whenever im pulled over ive always stayed in the car, turned off the engine and put my hands on my lap. I dont get out of the car purely because it shows that your trying to stand up to the police, and me being very tall (6"3) id be looking down on them and that challenges their power.

PhatBat · 26-12-2005, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MYVYSS

OK so Devils Advocate here,

I get pulled over for speeding, before the ticket is issued I ask for a Lawyer, copper Laughs and gives me a ticket, I fight it in court, and tell them exactly what happened....does that make the ticket Inadmissible in court as improper police procedure has been executed, which in turn means the ticket is NULL and VOID....BINGO NO MORE SPEEDING FINES EVER.....

All the cooper has to say is yea sure you can have a lawyer, hands you the ticket, and yer scewed. Stop trying to beat the system. Remember you were speeding.

HOON69 · 26-12-2005, 09:14 AM

lmfao love these threads
love it when members claim the "dont be doing anything illegal and you'll be right"
we all break the law in some form probably more then you'll know,but on topic as thats how it should stay..

name
address
DOB
anything after that isnt required
police have to prove you were doing something illegal or acting suspicious before searching your car and you can basically do the above and unless being arrested you don't have to say or do much more then that..

unless being fined or arrested they have no rights to harrass you.

PhatBat · 26-12-2005, 09:21 AM

Just remember! Certain laws have changed in recent WEEKS to give police greater powers to apprehend. All bought about from the recent Sydney problems. Do you know what they are???.......cause I don't.

I beleive one is that you have to, if asked, give police your name & address now even if you are walking down the street where before you didn't.

Not to be confused with....if you are a driver in a car you always had to give name & address.

Cheers

P.S
I respect the law....I dodn't respect the attidude of SOME enforcers.

HOON69 · 26-12-2005, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RED_EL_XR8

Don't be and act like a toss-pot in public and on public roads!

Don't be the idiot whose stupidity and idiotic acts shine above the stupidity of others in a sea of idiots!

Don't associate and congregate with idiots in the pursuance of idiotic behavior!

Consider the value of fitting that "book me" accessory or those illegal mods, (particularly those mods that serve no value for performance or handling and serve no purpose other than to impress the wearers of ill fitting trousers.)

If pulled over, consider before blurting out terms like "Harassment" and a plethora of swine and farmyard related insults, what harassment actually entails!

Before playing bush lawyer consider for at least a moment, that for you law is a part time pursuit and you are taking on a professional that does this stuff for a living (as well as pulling fools that knew better out of trashed vehicles and delivering news to their relatives) , so odds on the guy in the uniform knows more angles than you have ever dreamed of, and knows all the "get out of gaol" free clauses.

I've held a drivers license longer than many reader here have been on the planet, and in nearly 30 years can only recall one booking that I'd consider was unfair amongst numerous bookings.

Powers to search vehicles etc will fall under many acts and provisions from many areas of law, to follow or rely on interpretations of one set of laws is foolhardy indeed.

You do have to exit a vehicle when requested, failing to do so after a police officer has adequately identified them-self is defying a reasonable request from a police officer and entitles you to be apprehended.

Ever wondered why some people are driving away in minutes and others are detained on the roadside for an eternity? Guess which ones copped the ticket or warnings, and which ones were lippy and playing the "I know my rights card".

It's hardly rocket science and it doesn't take numerous incorrect or ill advised legal interpretations to work out!

i could so tear alot of this reply to shreds with case numbers and court appearances it aint funny
but i'll respect mr pol pol on this note and say
LIKE DRIVERS and LIKE COPS you have your lippy's and your respectable type
not all cases are open and shut the way you put it.

must admit i've sat on the side of a road for 90 mins one time,and on others no more then 2minutes it doesnt depend on you it depends on the cop on how far they wanna go with the offense or enquire,by the time they do
licence check
registration check
warrants
criminal record
and sometimes passenger enquire,theres a good 15minutes outta your time.

though i agree with 50% of what your saying.

RED_EL_XR8 · 26-12-2005, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HOON69

lmfao love these threads
love it when members claim the "dont be doing anything illegal and you'll be right"
we all break the law in some form probably more then you'll know,but on topic as thats how it should stay..

Try it you may be surprised! But then more accurately try a little common sense, most coppers will give you more than a sporting chance, with excess speed, if you spot them quickly and immediately curb your speed. The ones that get done are usually the ones that sailed through obliviously.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HOON69

name
address
DOB
anything after that isn't required

police have to prove you were doing something illegal or acting suspicious before searching your car and you can basically do the above and unless being arrested you don't have to say or do much more then that..

Yeah but try the silent type uncooperative tact, and see which offence they select out of a book of possible options.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HOON69

unless being fined or arrested they have no rights to harrass you.

No! Police never have a right to harass you!
You can laugh at those members who have the common sense to show a little respect and be polite, or those that cop the smaller fines when they have over-done it. But those same people will have the last laugh when they drive pass all the Bush Lawyers and self proclaimed Harassed who are now catching the bus for the next 12 months.

Like I said above its not rocket science!

PhatBat · 26-12-2005, 09:59 AM

Senario that involved my 15 y/o son: Abridged accounts....

Son & 3 friends walking home 1 night and 1 of his mates said hey look and picked up (stole) a solar light from a garden. Chased and apprehended by owner. Police came.......all 4 back to police station.......

My son interviewed (by now, 2:AM with me present) and the police said if you admit guilt, you will be let off with an official caution. Me in my ignorance told my son to admit guilt and all will be over.

Little did I know that there is a BIG difference between an official caution and a warning. An official caution is where you have to be councilled by a councillor and a member of everyday public to get you to realize what you did
was wrong. Your name and details are on record as a juvenile offender. This was never explained to me. A warning is a foot up the bum.

After seeking legal advise, they said because he was not aware that his mate was going to take the light, he cannot bare any responsibility.

I went back to the police station and they said too bad....he knows right from wrong. I explained that he cant know wrong if it is not premeditated. That comments response was a shrug.

I rang the councillor and told her that my son will not be attending the "hearing" on the grounds that the police used unfair tactics in getting my son to admit guilt. I quoted her a couple of sections from the "YOUNG OFFENDERS ACT" and she then agreed and backed down.

Three days later it was overturned without any caution OR warning. I also told her that under that Act, ALL logged information had to be destroyed as if the incident never happened to which she agreed.

The thing that P!SSED me off the most is when I went back to the police station conveying my rights, it was shrugged off. (AND) the 24 hours it took me to read and understand the relevant sections of the Young Offenders Act.

I just thought I would share this with you guys. To be FULLY AWARE of your rights is not being a smart ars3.

Cheers

RED_EL_XR8 · 26-12-2005, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhatBat

Senario that involved my 15 y/o son: Abridged accounts....

Son & 3 friends walking home 1 night and 1 of his mates said hey look and picked up (stole) a solar light from a garden. Chased and apprehended by owner. Police came.......all 4 back to police station.......

My son interviewed (by now, 2:AM with me present) and the police said if you admit guilt, you will be let off with an official caution. Me in my ignorance told my son to admit guilt and all will be over.

Little did I know that there is a BIG difference between an official caution and a warning. An official caution is where you have to be councilled by a councillor and a member of everyday public to get you to realize what you did
was wrong. Your name and details are on record as a juvenile offender. This was never explained to me. A warning is a foot up the bum.

After seeking legal advise, they said because he was not aware that his mate was going to take the light, he cannot bare any responsibility.

I went back to the police station and they said too bad....he knows right from wrong. I explained that he cant know wrong if it is not premeditated. That comments response was a shrug.

I rang the councillor and told her that my son will not be attending the "hearing" on the grounds that the police used unfair tactics in getting my son to admit guilt. I quoted her a couple of sections from the "YOUNG OFFENDERS ACT" and she then agreed and backed down.

Three days later it was overturned without any caution OR warning. I also told her that under that Act, ALL logged information had to be destroyed as if the incident never happened to which she agreed.

The thing that P!SSED me off the most is when I went back to the police station conveying my rights, it was shrugged off. (AND) the 24 hours it took me to read and understand the relevant sections of the Young Offenders Act.

I just thought I would share this with you guys. To be FULLY AWARE of your rights is not being a smart ars3.

Cheers

Make 15yo angel aware that Knocking of other peoples property, whether its a car or some ****y garden light no difference. Know right from wrong and you wont need to know any rights!!!

And I suppose these hard done by 150yo's all put their hand in their pockets and compensated the victims before they were all off bleating about THEIR rights! No? Didn't think so!!!
Responsible parent would have been up the kid for the rent, so coppers can go and catch "The Real Criminals"!!!
Reality IS the cood should have been charged and should have carried the childhood offence, consider you got off lightly.

HOON69 · 26-12-2005, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RED_EL_XR8

Try it you may be surprised! But then more accurately try a little common sense, most coppers will give you more than a sporting chance, with excess speed, if you spot them quickly and immediately curb your speed. The ones that get done are usually the ones that sailed through obliviously.
Yeah but try the silent type uncooperative tact, and see which offence they select out of a book of possible options.
No! Police never have a right to harass you!
You can laugh at those members who have the common sense to show a little respect and be polite, or those that cop the smaller fines when they have over-done it. But those same people will have the last laugh when they drive pass all the Bush Lawyers and self proclaimed Harassed who are now catching the bus for the next 12 months.
Like I said above its not rocket science!

never said or qouted speeding as the thing that causes Mr POL POL to get angry with you before he comes to the car,now did i?

common sense is like professionlism be professional i'll be polite,its quite simple really and guess what its also common sense.

do you remember your rights,you have the right to remain silent,say your name your DOB your addy everything after is evidence.

like i said not every cop is gunna be nice just "cause" YOU decided to be "polite"

heres 2 cases for you
i ran a orange light (police officer was at macca stuffing his face heard my car kick back as i was too late to brake and just put foot down abit as to not run red etc,btw its a 70 zone and i was only doing 60 at the time) he comes out and at the time i never knew he was behind me come 2minutes later he's nearly side swipping cars to get behind me,anyways 25minutes later and alot of abuse by him teling me im full of crap and never wanted to hear my side of the story,i just said yes officer to shut him the hell up and drove off..
now this could of been sorted by giving me a fine or just letting me go,but instead i was given the 3rd degree..

wifes driving in nsw some back country road lots of guys and boats,missus passes them at 120 in 100 zone cops on side of road see's it radar gun and all and BAM were pulled up he does he's check he tells us to slow up in future and wishes us merry xmas and were off again...

i had the same attitude that my wife did,nice calm and cooperative,yet 2 different attitudes by mr pol pol..

like i said not every cop is gunna shake your hand and let you go just cause your roll playing to em..

each case is individual as are the offences,mr pol pol is never gunna be the same as the next,and sorry but a majority of the community love them when the need em and hate them when they get pulled up by them..

comes with the job..

RED_EL_XR8 · 26-12-2005, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HOON69

heres 2 cases for you

i ran a orange light ....................................

Orange or Pale Red?

Quote:

Originally Posted by HOON69

wifes driving in nsw some back country road lots of guys and boats,missus passes them at 120 in 100

And the point is? Many oif us inadvertantly end up speeding. But the real offence is speeding whilst totally oblivious to all around you including roadside police traps.

Both cases, did the crime! If a copper is lenient consider yourself lucky, antagonising one have never helped not once, not ever!

RED_EL_XR8 · 26-12-2005, 10:29 AM

It wasn't the son being bagged! I can see the problem he faces though!

HOON69 · 26-12-2005, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RED_EL_XR8

Orange or Pale Red?

And the point is? Many oif us inadvertantly end up speeding. But the real offence is speeding whilst totally oblivious to all around you including roadside police traps.

Both cases, did the crime! If a copper is lenient consider yourself lucky, antagonising one have never helped not once, not ever!

see that's what you dont get
we all speed we all break laws,every case is different to the next
that also goes with attitudes

btw i ran a orange at the speed limit and got off
my missus went around boats with a cop sitting in the bushes of to a side road 200 metres away,see not every case is black and white nor are the laws
to what your rights are..

see you missed my point
MY OFFENSE COULD OF COP'D ME A FINE but it didnt instead i got a cranky cop looking to vent cause i interupted his lunch break
MY WIFE COP'D A FINE (aint disputing the fact she broke the law am i)
she still got fined yet spoken to with 100% professionlism and respect..

cases vary thats my point
i could stay quiet and if the cop was law abiding and straight up would see im taking my rights
if the cop doesnt respect my rights then he's get the attitude and book out ready to rape my rectum big time

like i stated to you its not all black n white!

XA-Coupe · 26-12-2005, 11:11 AM

Frankly I am quite tired of people offering excuses and giving scenarios where they feel they were hard done by. I am quite aware of why you feel hard done by Hoon and I would suggest you just leave this alone.... you are hardly unbiased.

PhatBat .. you get a holiday for abusing a moderator. You can get your point across without resorting to abuse, particularly on a forum staff member. 3 days. I won't tolerate it regardless of what the issue is.
By the way, it's not the police's job to educate you about the law regardless of what you think may or may not assume at the time. You did the correct thing later by investigating it but I wouldn't blame the police for your ignorance.. unless you asked a specific question and got a specific wrong answer.. which you don't state.
If you want to complain about coppers go elsewhere, this is a thread about knowing your rights.

RSgerry · 26-12-2005, 01:01 PM

we've all met rude coppers. just like we have all met rude bank tellers, teachers, shop assistants and mechanics. just like any other job, there are good and bad. my last ticket was given to me by a bloke that was very personable and we ended up laughing about the hoon whose car he had confiscated a couple of nights before. as for the arguement that the police harass high performance cars, i dont think it holds up. i was booked while driving a Ford Sierra with a factory body kit that is as subtle as a punch on the nose. the police were interested in the car simply because it is rare, but i was pulled over for speeding.

there are rude police, you just need to be a bit more careful with them.

LUXO_8 · 26-12-2005, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Psycho Chicken

I'm not even gonna bother reading that. So what, you know your rights. There is ALWAYS something up a copper's sleve. Be a smartarse to a hard cop and he'll just do you over twice as hard.

I've been caught doing stupid things and never had anything more than a lighter wallet and a few more demerit points, even though the coppers could of absolutely stuffed me. One even said he could of sent me to court if he wanted to.

The way I see it, you've got two choices; respect the cop and admit you've stuffed up, get off fairly lightly or act like a smartarse trying to list every single one of your rights, only to have the copper throw a much heavier book right back at you. Yes there are ***** coppers around. Cop it on the chin and go talk to his sergeant later on, assuming you haven't been sprung doing something dumb.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walkinshaw

I'm gonna agree with rob here. Im NOT a road saint, however in my time ive paid less than $300 in fines and lost 2points, however im sure i could have been done for MUCH MUCH more (and have no vehicle as a result). So 5 steps to keeping your nose clean when you do get in trouble.

(1) Smile
(2) Be polite
(3) Do everything they ask for
(4) Thank them
(5) Smile

Agreed 100%
i to have only had a couple hunge of fines, where it could have been far far greater...

in every case bar 2, ive been let go with a warning, and those 2 i got a very light punishment where it could have been far worse...

it very much pays to be polite, and do what you're told....

grown up a lot these days but.......