Humble Station Wagon Making a Comeback..

[OzJavelin]

Originally Posted by Windsor220

Its this reason that they have bought out cars like the CX5, Kuga, ASX etc. They would be easier to park than a Falcodore wagon while providing space for the family. If you want to go a bit bigger you go something like Territory. These types of cars weren't around back in the day so the wagon was the only choice. Sure there a handful of people that still want a normal wagon but its obvious to see now what the majority prefer.

Jeep Cherokee - the original SUV "box" - has been around since 1960 .. Along with the GM/Chev Suburban, International TravelAll, etc.

[El Venom]

All wagons are great but I am biased as I own a wagon and am part of a wagon club for australian enthusiasts

[Windsor220]

Originally Posted by OzJavelin

Jeep Cherokee - the original SUV "box" - has been around since 1960 .. Along with the GM/Chev Suburban, International TravelAll, etc.

I don't think these are classed as small SUVs.....

[flappist]

Originally Posted by TheInterceptor

Yeah, id have bought a brand newie back in '01 except i was 8 years old then.....

11 years later, Ford Aus sell nothing id buy new, and nothing beat the AUII to me for my needs, everything is just perfect..even build quality.

Damn shame indeed but if people want bloated SUV things and small FWD things...thats what theyll get... Wish that wasnt so but hey.

But would you pay $41k today for a brand new wagon in the same spec as your AU?

[jpd80]

Many people have short memories about how hard Falcon station wagons were for women to maneuver
in a tight car park, the Fairlane sized wheelbase and overhangs coupled with low visibility make then
harder for most to park compared to a SUV like Territory.

Originally Posted by flappist

But would you pay $41k today for a brand new wagon in the same spec as your AU?

Bingo, Territory does most things people want in a wagon plus gives higher driving position
but most importantly a fuel sipping diesel.

[csv8]

Originally Posted by flappist

And that was the problem. Apart from fleets very few people did.

Falcon Wagon started to die in the late e series/early AU.

Firstly manuals were discontinued due to lack of sales.
Then the Ghia.
Then V8
Then Fairmont.
Finally by BA all that was selling was auto XT for fleets and the odd Futura.

Falcon wagon is dead because no one wanted to buy it other than low profit fleet sales.

Now who here has actually bought a NEW Falcon wagon privately in the last 20 years? (EB onward).

I did a Fairmont AU 3 V8 !!!!

[TheInterceptor]

Originally Posted by flappist

But would you pay $41k today for a brand new wagon in the same spec as your AU?

That is a good question. If an FG is just as reliable and just as big as an AUII, and IF i had $41k to blow on a brand new car the answer would be yes.
I could probably get over the fly by wire crap maybe..and hope it steers better than a BF.
Itd be something id keep very long term..like my AUII.

I dont need nor want fancy gadgets and features.
A new car has no history and no previous owners. Thats something that i would have loved with my AUII! Id love a brand new car just for that.

Originally Posted by jpd80

Many people have short memories about how hard Falcon station wagons were for women to maneuver
in a tight car park, the Fairlane sized wheelbase and overhangs coupled with low visibility make then
harder for most to park compared to a SUV like Territory.


Bingo, Territory does most things people want in a wagon plus gives higher driving position
but most importantly a fuel sipping diesel.

Hard to manouver? I see lots of people that find Yaris's Corolla's and Excel's hard to park...

[RedHotGT]

Make an XR8 wagon - and i'm interested.........

[zilo]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Many people have short memories about how hard Falcon station wagons were for women to maneuver
in a tight car park, the Fairlane sized wheelbase and overhangs coupled with low visibility make then
harder for most to park compared to a SUV like Territory.


Bingo, Territory does most things people want in a wagon plus gives higher driving position
but most importantly a fuel sipping diesel.

Falcon wagon is a piece of cake to park with a rear camera.

Just upgrade the sound system, get one with the GPS and camera and problem completely solved.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by loftie

Make an XR8 wagon - and i'm interested.........

Will never happen but there is no reason why you can't make your own.

Dead BF XR8 ute + BF wagon = BF XR8 Wagon or use a dead Pursuit and make something really special.

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Everyone buys SUV's now. Ford Aus are just lucky they were smart enough to build the Territory back in 2004...

I would never have bought a Falcon wagon... All they were good for were taxi's and Telstra fleet, my Territory smashes the wagon all day everyday.

I don't know too many Falcon wagons that would do 850 - 900 km's week in week out on a single tank of fuel.

I reckon the Territory is easier to drive, extra vision. My Mrs agrees, shes says its so much easier to use in car parks because she can see pass the cars around her, especially when backing out of a space.

All those points to the Territory yes, but it doesn't have the load space which is what we're talking about.

Fuel mileage - I suppose you're talking about a diesel Territory but you have to compare like with like to be fair. A diesel Falcon would probably do 1000 on a tank.

[Jim Goose]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Many people have short memories about how hard Falcon station wagons were for women to maneuver
in a tight car park, the Fairlane sized wheelbase and overhangs coupled with low visibility make then
harder for most to park compared to a SUV like Territory.


Bingo, Territory does most things people want in a wagon plus gives higher driving position
but most importantly a fuel sipping diesel.

You have to be kidding right?
Like i siad in my previous post... go to a shopping center carpark and watch how many females cant park their "SUVS"... er sorry... 4WDs because these things are just as big, if not bigger then a Falcon wagon and have a much less turning circle.

Because some of them also sit up so damned high YOU CANT SEE the car next to you out the rear windows half the time either. (so you resort to using the mirror.. but most people DONT)

[new2ford]

Slightly OT but on that point, Territory needs outside mirrors that tilt down automatically when you reverse. Yes it is a dog to park without a reverse camera because of all the curves. But not all SUVs - my old Range Rover was a dream to park even compared to a car because of the square shape, you could judge the corners. The Rangie and Territory do, however, have a smaller footprint than a Falcon wagon. But then they don't have the load space do they. The automatic reverse park feature available on VAG cars mightn't go astray on these wagons, especially for the ladies eh?

[aussie muscle]

i can't imagine wagons coming back in any significant way

[MAGPIE]

Originally Posted by TheInterceptor

Ah, key word was station in my post.

sta·tion wag·on
Noun:
A car with a long body, incorporating a large carrying area behind the seats and having a rear door for easy loading.

Yeah, i agree with you, there are many different sorts of wagons.
But a Focus wagon isnt a station wagon! So i disagree when you say it is as much a wagon as a Falcon wagon.
Wouldn't a Falcon wagon be more versatile than a Sportswagon?

Don't be ridiculous....

Any vehicle that has a wagon body type ( as opposed to sedan or hatch type) is a wagon/station wagon/estate or whatever you want to call it irrespective of the size of the vehicle

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

You have to be kidding right?
Like i siad in my previous post... go to a shopping center carpark and watch how many females cant park their "SUVS"... er sorry... 4WDs because these things are just as big, if not bigger then a Falcon wagon and have a much less turning circle.

Your part of the world is not indicative of the rest of Australia. There are plenty of small
and mid sized SUVs that are a snap to park, not everyone drives a jacked up 4 x 4 Landcrab.

[Ford_The_Win]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Your part of the world is not indicative of the rest of Australia. There are plenty of small
and mid sized SUVs that are a snap to park, not everyone drives a jacked up 4 x 4 Landcrab.

Yep - CR-V, CSX, Rav-4, Forester etc. I rarely see Landcruisers getting around in suburban Melbourne and I never see Patrols or Pajeros. The Territory is about as big as they seem to get. I can see why too because when you're trying to get around in one of those bush pig mobiles, other drivers are really not very nice to me.

[BFZ Wagon]

The station wagon is only unpopular here in Australia.
Even NZ love the wagon. They even get the Corolla and Focus wagon and that country only has a population of just over 4 million.

Wagons are also very popular in the UK and Europe. That's why we see so many of the Euro marque's with wagon models here. We don't get all the variants obviously... For instance, they still offer a manual transmission on many cars in the UK/Europe whereas some only send the auto model to Australia as Aussies are lazy and only ever want to drive auto cars.

This country also seems to be overly obsessed with SUVs as well. It's sad really.

[SpoolMan]

Commodore wagon sales make a healthy chunk of the overall Commodore sales.

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by SpoolMan

Commodore wagon sales make a healthy chunk of the overall Commodore sales.

But...do they add sales, or are they mearly just "replacing" sedan sales....? As in, are people opting to buy VE wagon over a VE sedan, rather then a VE wagon over say, a Captiva...

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by Ford_The_Win

Yep - CR-V, CSX, Rav-4, Forester etc. I rarely see Landcruisers getting around in suburban Melbourne and I never see Patrols or Pajeros. The Territory is about as big as they seem to get. .

Yeah that's true. These are the soccer mum cars these days. I very rarely see them in LandCruisers and anything close to that size.

I'd say the average small to mid sized 4WDs are easier to park then a Falcon Wagon.

I personally wouldn't buy a car wagon. I want a wagon next year, but Ill be going for a 4wd one.

[RedHotGT]

After owning a Wagon - in my situation i'd never buy a sedan again.

The wagon is much more practical for my situation (read: 4 kids) and I really loved having a wagon variant of a very popular sedan (read: Previous XR6 wagon owner).

I now own a Territory - because the sedan simply couldn't meet my requirements. I nearly bought an F6X (the unloved and very expensive F6 Territory) but couldn't justify the extra expense.

My problem is - the car that I want isn't available - and it's not actually viable for a company to produce (which I understand).

So - old cars will just have to replace the void that a sports styled wagon leaves in my garage.

[fordlova8]

I have a BA wagon and love it, It is just as comfy as a sedan goes just as well as an equivalent sedan and find it far easier to park than a sedan due to the bigger glass house plus i can fit a multitude of stuff in the back i.e. camping gear, DIY materials my two dogs and three kids try that with a sedan. I owned a Territory before it and it was comfy but that was the only good point.

[Jim Goose]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Your part of the world is not indicative of the rest of Australia. There are plenty of small
and mid sized SUVs that are a snap to park, not everyone drives a jacked up 4 x 4 Landcrab.

Ahh.. sigh... point missed again.

Most 4WD are already "jacked" up in standard form and the point I was making was not in regard to SOFT ROADERS... but 4WDs.
MOST 4WDS have a large turning circle and poor rear visibility because they sit so high up you cant see a car beside you.. (please re-read what I said).

Im pretty sure the 4WDs in this part of the country are the same models sold all over the country.....

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by BFZ Wagon

Wagons are also very popular in the UK and Europe. That's why we see so many of the Euro marque's with wagon models here. We don't get all the variants obviously... For instance, they still offer a manual transmission on many cars in the UK/Europe whereas some only send the auto model to Australia as Aussies are lazy and only ever want to drive auto cars.

This country also seems to be overly obsessed with SUVs as well. It's sad really.

Yes, spot on - except I'm surprised at the number of SUVs in Europe too. Heaps and heaps of them, especially the big ones. Australians tend to forget there's serious big money floating around in Europe, lots of people not short of a quid, much more than Australia.

Where I live, Plzen, Czech Republic, is an industrial city the size of Wollongong - except that the industry is big and booming. The Gong has one extra-mega shopping centre, Shellharbour. Plzen has about 5 Shellharbours, most of them much bigger with far more stuff (and good quality and half the price!).

Now I'm in a car wagon, not the Territory, my biggest bugbear is the number of big SUVs who park next to you so you can't see when getting out of a parking spot (we're talking Europe remember not Australia)! But also, getting a bit old and creaky, I must say getting down into a car is not so much for me nowadays, I like the height of the Territory for getting in and out of.

Oh and I'd like to add, I don't think an auto's a matter of laziness. Manuals are simply a pain in the butt to drive, especially in city traffic. They only come into their own on the open road and even then the difference is very marginal - and you don't get cruise control.

[K_Man]

Originally Posted by new2ford

But also, getting a bit old and creaky, I must say getting down into a car is not so much for me nowadays, I like the height of the Territory for getting in and out of.

Only reason my missus wants a soft roader, back isnt coping very well with getting bubs in and out of the car. We only have a tl magna wagon, but jeezus some of the suvs we've looked at have small boots compared to the poor old magna.

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by Windsor220

Its this reason that they have bought out cars like the CX5, Kuga, ASX etc. They would be easier to park than a Falcodore wagon while providing space for the family. If you want to go a bit bigger you go something like Territory. These types of cars weren't around back in the day so the wagon was the only choice. Sure there a handful of people that still want a normal wagon but its obvious to see now what the majority prefer.

Exactly. The SUV has taken over. They can be shorter because they provide more room vertically. And being higher off of the ground, they are easier for older people to get in and out of. And also easier to take stuff out and put stuff in.

As much as I hate these taller cars on our roads because I own a normal height vehicle. I fully understand and appreciate these values that I listed above.

Perhaps a Falcon Wagon lifted up like the RTV... could answer some of that issue. However... the Holden Adventra was a flop, so that might indicate popularity for that configuration. (Don't see many Adventra's for resale though)

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

Ahh.. sigh... point missed again.

Most 4WD are already "jacked" up in standard form and the point I was making was not in regard to SOFT ROADERS... but 4WDs.
MOST 4WDS have a large turning circle and poor rear visibility because they sit so high up you cant see a car beside you.. (please re-read what I said).

Im pretty sure the 4WDs in this part of the country are the same models sold all over the country.....

But by volume of sales, 4WDs make up a much smaller percentage of the SUVs and Crossovers actually sold,
See, this is perception, you're making the case that the Falcon S/W is easier to park than a large 4 x 4,
I don't disagree but what I'm saying is a SUVs like Territory, RAV4, CX-5 are easier to park than a Statoin wagon
because drivers have a higher seating position and can mostly turn tighter than a Falcon S/W...can we agree?

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Many people have short memories about how hard Falcon station wagons were for women to maneuver
in a tight car park, the Fairlane sized wheelbase and overhangs coupled with low visibility make then
harder for most to park compared to a SUV like Territory.

Ahhhh.... memories of my small mother trying to park an XE GLi station wagon with no power steering and and fat chrome mags. And a turning circle of what seemed like infinity to infinity.

Comedy Gold.

[OffRoadFalcon]

Everyone who's talked to me would know I'm a wagon fanatic and I could go on and on about them forever, I've written a report all about them for school. There's loads of excellent points in here that I agree with, and many I don't as well haha!

I'm happy to allow for SUV and all to remain, but what I do dislike is the tendancy of recent times to replace station wagons with them.

I will comment on the difficulty/easy of parking them.
I did one lesson before my driving assessment (1 week before) and I found the instructor's Getz frustrating to drive. Not hard, but it has quite large blind spots due to the rear pillars, and many new cars share that, as well as the sloping bonnet meaning I can't see the front!
So I decided to do the test in the AUII wagon. I can see all four corners very easily in a wagon, becaus the corners of the tailgate arent much shorter than the actual back of the car, and with the bull bar on the front, I can see that as well, I have no troubles at all parking or manourvering it. It's actually quite enjoyable weaving it through tight spots.

I'll be RTVing the AUII as soon as I can so I can have all I love about the Falcon body, but make it more capable of going the places I like to go.

I'd really love to create a custom retro styled wagon one day in the future... bold, big and powerful... over 6 metres long and 2.2m wide...
Wagon's are more fun than anything else to me.