Damn Aurion vs G6 in a 0-60 dash!

[Professor Farnsworth]

the MPS is a quick and agile piece of kit, i agree it would very much be the trump card in stock for stock, and even stock for some modified falcon battles.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by PRODIGAL SON

You of all people should know better than to challenge me ?

I take all comers on any piece of road or track .. I have a skid pan day coming up in Gympie where i am organising to shut a few turbo forum bois down !!

I will PM you the link

Keep it off the street and on the track where it belongs

[geckoGT]

Originally Posted by PRODIGAL SON

You of all people should know better than to challenge me ?

I take all comers on any piece of road or track .. I have a skid pan day coming up in Gympie where i am organising to shut a few turbo forum bois down !!

I will PM you the link

You were talking mountain roads and now you change to skid pan, no thanks. I will concede that your RWD falcon will pull better powerskids than my FWD JCW, but that is not really handling is it?

You want a road speed and handling challenge, hill climb is the way to go, you say you can dust off Mazda MPS's with ease in the mountains, how about a Mini JCW (or I can arrange a APR tuned Golf GTI as well)?

[geckoGT]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Keep it off the street and on the track where it belongs

You should know I would never take it onto the street.

[winovin]

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

FWD will always have that edge right off the line. But the Falcon will get out in front of about 50-70 metres of that race.

That's if the Aurion hasn't torque steered into you or a traffic light pole.

FWD will not have the edge - other things being equal, RWD has the edge: acceleration shifts the weight distribution towards the rear, and a RWD will put the power down better.

[geckoGT]

Originally Posted by winovin

FWD will not have the edge - other things being equal, RWD has the edge: acceleration shifts the weight distribution towards the rear, and a RWD will put the power down better.

Correct, getting the Mini off the line quickly without wheel spin is like balancing on a razors edge, the typhoon is so much easier.

[nstg8a]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

*Torque

Anywhoo, I'd put a 1999 DC2 Integra Type R against a Falcon in the twisties any day and I'd put money on it too.

id put money on it even if the integra was dead stock...

[FGII-XR6]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

*Torque

Anywhoo, I'd put a 1999 DC2 Integra Type R against a Falcon in the twisties any day and I'd put money on it too.

I concede your point but I think you get my meaning. generally you get a powerful car it has good torque too ( rotaries excluded of course) so my meaning was you have a powerful FWD it suffers with torque steer

remember front wheels should be lifted not driven

[MexicanBatman]

Aurions are better than falcons!

Well the hire car that was brand-new when I got it and flogged out after over a week of Tasmania was better than my FG

Only things that suck other than being fwd, the ****** manual mode, cos it shifts when in manual mode automatically... The ****** radio, but that said it's easily more upgradable than the FG's and the non switchable hoon sensing ESP, as soon as wheel slip is thought of, throttle is killed.... Really makes it hard to thrash on take off.. Other than that I'd much prefer that to driving my car around the island, had to make some emergency stops on blind corners in the dark (I don't like running over wildlife standing in the middle of the road) and it performed better than my ford would have in a similar situation, and the low beam is better, better economy.... And they hammer, nice rev happy motor, and it was miles better than the VE I got the next time for a week, ****** heaps better than that..

[Falc'man]

Yeah the Aurion's quicker than the Falcon in acceleration, and so is the SV6. We're only talking one or two tenths but that's one or two car lengths over the quarter. The trick with the Falcon is knowing how to take off ie applying correct throttle percentage off the line - get it right and the V6s won't know which way you went, corners or not (stuff like that happens when you've got over 100Nm/litre... X 4).

[XR Martin]

Ever driven an Aurion without the traction control? Stomp on the park brake, then floor the throttle for instant smoke screen.

[Professor Farnsworth]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

Ever driven an Aurion without the traction control? Stomp on the park brake, then floor the throttle for instant smoke screen.

then book in for two wrist reconstructions

[prasac]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

Ever driven an Aurion without the traction control? Stomp on the park brake, then floor the throttle for instant smoke screen.

i like ur style. try 150km/h Scandanavian flicks - much fun's

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by PRODIGAL SON

If you openly admit a mazda will lunch your favourite car then you have not spent enough money on your driveline !!

I've spent roughly $0 You are coming to the April 29th cruise yes? I think I need a demo of the Dazzler sled!

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Anywhoo, I'd put a 1999 DC2 Integra Type R against a Falcon in the twisties any day and I'd put money on it too.

Amen to that. Two mates of mine have them, one with coilovers, they are definitely a formidable handler.

[wrongwaynorris]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

what if its raining??? or the car has 3/4 passengers???or a trailer...

Very different story then believe me .

[wrongwaynorris]

Originally Posted by Professor Farnsworth

then book in for two wrist reconstructions

So true , I drive one of these abominations every day as a company hack and it is a tour de force of torque steer , in the wet it is lock to lock stuff as the thing goes from one side of the road to the other never ever pointing where you have the wheel pointed . These are nasty dangerous cars .

[duaned]

I liken the ride of an AT-X Aurion to that of an EA Falcon. It feels like crossing the harbour on the manly ferry in another vessel's wake. Bounce and more bounce! (In fact, the FG Taxi I rode in this morning reminded me of the above mentioned excursion.) But I would agree the Aurion does accelerate from rest the 100km/h faster than the porky falcon. The Lexus IS350 adds direct injection to the same donk as the aurion, and pulls a 5.7 sec sprint to 100km/h. Not to bad for 233 killer watts!

[RAREV8]

Originally Posted by winkle

I've also got an Aurion as a company car. It's the first company car I've ever had (at age 44) and I'm bloody glad to have it. Being a Ford man (I've owned 4 Falcons and a Territory - all bought new) I was dubious about the Aurion at first, but it's won me over. In 9 months I've done 22,000 km and the car was brand new. These cars are very well made (have not had one thing wrong with it - can't say the same about the Fords) very comfortable and pretty fuel efficient. Best economy I've got was 8.37 l/100km on a round trip Ballarat Shepparton and return and it regularly gets under 9, usually driving at 110 with the A/C on. Mine is the base model AT-X and is very well equipped and very comfortable to drive. I have driven 5 hours Ballarat to Mildura non-stop several times and got out of the car feeling very fresh. I tested it out once and quickly got to 200 before I ran out of road.

These are pretty bloody good car. Sure it's got a reputation as boring and disposable white-good etc, but there is no denying they are a worthy competitor to the Falcon. Doesn't mean I'd buy one, as I've got my eye on a G6E when we update the Territory. But when you can pick up a second hand one with minimal k's for around $25,000, you'd have to look closely at it.

After many generations of company Fords and privately owned ones (XC, FA LTD, Landau, BA, BF, BF mkII, FG G6) I now have an Aurion and on some points I agree with the above post, on others not so.
To settle the initial thread starters question, in a straight line the Aurion is a LOT faster than either the 5 or 6 speed Falcons......however, should you take both an Aurion and an FG for a spat around some corners, the Falcon will win as the Aurion simply cannot put its power to the road efficiently due to the front wheel drive and suspension/ tyre package.
Mine is an entry level AT-X so I would be interested in seeing if they do this any better on the higher models?

Although I am a big Ford fan, I thought I would try to put together a quick, objective comparison between the two cars- this is far from exhaustive but simply what I have noticed:

What I like about the Aurion:

1) Nippy accelleration off the mark (straight line)
20 Sunglass holder
3) Auto up drivers window
4)cup holders not behind gear change
5) two 12v outputs
6)interior noise levels low, both from the wind and engine
7)dial controls over press buttons for AC, temp etc (looks worse but functions far better)
8)flat boot base
9)centre console size and twin compartments
10) bluetooth connection is seamless and audible

Dislikes:

1) low towing capacity (rendered this car all but useless to me outside of work)
2) pathological levels of torque steer and surging power upon accelleration
3) gearbox lags behind (see above issue)
4) console trim digs right into my left leg and is not only uncomfortable but is not attached properly
5) cheap looking and rather reflective silver centre display area
6) uncomfortable seats with no lateral support at all- dreadful on longer journeys
7) complete lack of digital readouts for speed, petrol etc as per Falcon entry level
8)no split rear folding seats
9) boot hinges reduce boot capacity badly and can damage contents if care is not taken when closing lid
10) very unstable at motorway speeds...not as sure footed as the rear wheel drive cars, nor compared to out '94 TX5??

Summary: Overall, a great family car for the money- they can be bought for under $30,000 brand new and at this price represent great value for money. Once you realise that the torque steering happens, you need to change your driving style to suit the limits of the car.

The Falcon simply has superior fit and finish, both inside the cabin and between panels which I found surprising and its comfort levels, equipment and sure-footedness, towing capacity is streets ahead of the Aurion.

So, is the Aurion worse than the Falcon? No, not really- it is designed with cost in mind and probably suits a different buyer, especially the cost conscious company fleet managers- fixed price servicing and fewer stops between bowsers coupled with a far more aggressive buy price sadly has left the Falcon high and dry for many now.

Sadly, for my own personal use and preferences, I would be heading towards the Falcon or maybe a Navarra but our company policy is one Aurion fits all.

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by Iggypoppin'

Everyone who buys a G6 or an Aurion buys it for the amazing speed of course....

Exactly

[dimka100]

I do not think the Aurion is faster than a 6 speed FG, here is why:

In the latest issue of Motor, there is an article talking about a rental XR6 vs the Ford 70s legend … anyways the rental XR6 ran a 6.8 to 100 and 14.8 for the quarter, I have never seen any publications showing the Aurion could do better. I’m also not sure if the rental XR6 was run on 91 or 98 octane as well all know the FGs make more power with premium.

As for many people thinking the Aurio is feeling faster well it’s all due to the revy nature of its engine, the driver simply feels like the car is going really fast when the engine revs out to 7000 rpm. The falcons engine is more about torque and hence when you take off it never feels that fast. The falcon would however easily out accelerate the Aurion if both cars had 3 passengers and luggage on-board.

However when it comes to the handling the XR6 walks all over any Aurio … they are just shocking, totally not a drivers car by any means of the imagination …

[2011G6E]

A lot of peoplelwho ignore anything not built by Ford or Holden are very surprised when push comes to shove, and sometimes actually get angry and quite hurt about it...look at Bathurst and the touring car races with the GTR Skylines...they kept handicapping and handicapping them to try and slow them down, as fans didn't want to accept that there actually is a subsititute for cubic inches: technology.

My son owns a 2007 Aurion with the 200kw V6, and it's a surprising motor...very revvy and smooth, and by christ does it fly. An FG might make 200 on Premium ULP, but the Aurion makes that on standard ULP. It also "feels" lighter than our G6E.

But yes, I didn't buy our Falcon because it's the quickest...it had everything we wanted and was the best deal, and is "quick enough"...i suppose that's because the last car I had with 270hp was a 1971 Charger with a heavily worked & extremely thirsty 265 Hemi...and the 4 liter in the Falcon is a constant marvel to me that it can be so efficient and still give such good performance.

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by RAREV8

After many generations of company Fords and privately owned ones (XC, FA LTD, Landau, BA, BF, BF mkII, FG G6) I now have an Aurion and on some points I agree with the above post, on others not so.
To settle the initial thread starters question, in a straight line the Aurion is a LOT faster than either the 5 or 6 speed Falcons......however, should you take both an Aurion and an FG for a spat around some corners, the Falcon will win as the Aurion simply cannot put its power to the road efficiently due to the front wheel drive and suspension/ tyre package.
Mine is an entry level AT-X so I would be interested in seeing if they do this any better on the higher models?

Although I am a big Ford fan, I thought I would try to put together a quick, objective comparison between the two cars- this is far from exhaustive but simply what I have noticed:

What I like about the Aurion:

1) Nippy accelleration off the mark (straight line)
20 Sunglass holder
3) Auto up drivers window
4)cup holders not behind gear change
5) two 12v outputs
6)interior noise levels low, both from the wind and engine
7)dial controls over press buttons for AC, temp etc (looks worse but functions far better)
8)flat boot base
9)centre console size and twin compartments
10) bluetooth connection is seamless and audible

Dislikes:

1) low towing capacity (rendered this car all but useless to me outside of work)
2) pathological levels of torque steer and surging power upon accelleration
3) gearbox lags behind (see above issue)
4) console trim digs right into my left leg and is not only uncomfortable but is not attached properly
5) cheap looking and rather reflective silver centre display area
6) uncomfortable seats with no lateral support at all- dreadful on longer journeys
7) complete lack of digital readouts for speed, petrol etc as per Falcon entry level
8)no split rear folding seats
9) boot hinges reduce boot capacity badly and can damage contents if care is not taken when closing lid
10) very unstable at motorway speeds...not as sure footed as the rear wheel drive cars, nor compared to out '94 TX5??

Summary: Overall, a great family car for the money- they can be bought for under $30,000 brand new and at this price represent great value for money. Once you realise that the torque steering happens, you need to change your driving style to suit the limits of the car.

The Falcon simply has superior fit and finish, both inside the cabin and between panels which I found surprising and its comfort levels, equipment and sure-footedness, towing capacity is streets ahead of the Aurion.

So, is the Aurion worse than the Falcon? No, not really- it is designed with cost in mind and probably suits a different buyer, especially the cost conscious company fleet managers- fixed price servicing and fewer stops between bowsers coupled with a far more aggressive buy price sadly has left the Falcon high and dry for many now.

Sadly, for my own personal use and preferences, I would be heading towards the Falcon or maybe a Navarra but our company policy is one Aurion fits all.

Fair analysis. My uncle has one for work. He is a total grandpa driver, and usually owned Ford's all his life I believe. He now owns a 4cyl Xtrail (grey nomad special), after finally handing down his sapphire to his young son.

He works for the water board, and has an Aurion for a company vehicle. He has commented on the acceleration.. and that's it. But he's a thorough person... so it's probably the only thing going for it.

My mum's half brother is completely anti-ford (******). He bought an Aurion. Not sure of the trim level... but definitely not the base. He raved on about it his entire visit last he was here. But then just as he was leaving, admitted he wanted to sell it. Reason. Having to have the front tyres swapped to the back every 10000k's. This for any motorist... instant exactly welcome. So now he wants a RWD car. Holden of course.

But to me in my objective and biased position. Large cars with a powerful engine going through the front wheels. Just aren't optimal.

[xr8ted]

My current company car is a 2010 aurion ATX and provided that it is not damp or wet, I can say that I can hose any standard n/a large 6 cylinder cars out there. The power to weight of the vehicle is better than an fg or ve and the gearing in the 6 Speed auto seems to make the most of what the engines got.

Once you work out how to launch it without the traction control interviening it's suprising how quickly it can accelerate, and this is from a through and through ford person.

However now that I have the job that comes with the car permanently, my next work car will be a G6 even though it will be a whisker slower than th aurion. This is due to the following gripes with the aurion:

- the drivers seat does not go back far enough for a person of my height (6 foot 4). Never have had that problem in a late model falcon or commodore)
- the chasis is an understeering mess when pushed hard (particularly tight corners).
- front wheel drive cars with good power are terrible in the wet.
- after about 2 hours drive the seats become really hard and uncomfortable.
- you feel like a dag driving it.

Things I will miss are:
- punchy acceleration
- great build quality is exceptional. The car feels brand new in every respect even after 50,000 km.
- huge boot (apart from stupid hinges)
- the look of shock on commodore drivers faces when you accelerate away from them. Hehe.

[spvd02]

Aurion would be quicker because:
a. it's a good 150kg lighter
b. it is FWD making power transmission more efficient (more power at the wheels).
c. Gearing suits the engine very well.

However, engine for engine, there doesn't seem to be much in it.
- Aurion makes 200kw, but so does the Falcon, pretty much (195kw on paper).
- Aurion makes 340nm at high rpm, Falcon makes 390nm at much lower rpm.
- Fuel economy is almost identical, despite more power-train loss in the Falcon, and heavier weight.

The Falcon will still tow better, and use its torque for more effortless driving. The Aurion is slightly quicker at full throttle, but part-throttle the Falcon is much better to drive (torque everywhere!).

IMO the Falcon is still easily the more practical car, as it is suited to more things, especially towing. The RWD and superior suspension set-up make it a more confidence-inspiring drive, which on its own would be more than enough reason for me to it over the Aurion.

[JC]

Now you know how I feel driving a Mitsu 380 as a daily. Will hose stock NA Falcon/Commondore 6s to 100, but a tad understeery when pushing hard, and "daggy" to drive!

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by spvd02

Aurion would be quicker because:
a. it's a good 150kg lighter
b. it is FWD making power transmission more efficient (more power at the wheels).
c. Gearing suits the engine very well.

However, engine for engine, there doesn't seem to be much in it.
- Aurion makes 200kw, but so does the Falcon, pretty much (195kw on paper).
- Aurion makes 340nm at high rpm, Falcon makes 390nm at much lower rpm.
- Fuel economy is almost identical, despite more power-train loss in the Falcon, and heavier weight.

The Falcon will still tow better, and use its torque for more effortless driving. The Aurion is slightly quicker at full throttle, but part-throttle the Falcon is much better to drive (torque everywhere!).

IMO the Falcon is still easily the more practical car, as it is suited to more things, especially towing. The RWD and superior suspension set-up make it a more confidence-inspiring drive, which on its own would be more than enough reason for me to it over the Aurion.

Ford has obviously hired some clever cookies of late. Because they aren't just trying to stuff electric motors into everything. They're trying to cut down their car's weight as well.

[prasac]

i have been a Ford my whole life, i made a decision to buy a new car. test drove a few XR6, Commondore and i ended up buying the ZR6 as it felt the best to drive and was better bang for buck, i thrash the hell out of the car at the track and street and i still get never worse than 11.5L/100km (average 10.5l) i know alot of Ford drivers that don't get anywhere near that. the Aurion's could definitely do with an exhaust, we were servicing it the other day, it was up on the hoist and i noticed how dodgy the exhaust setup is, it has 3 cats and so restrictive up near the headers, i swear it would pick-up 20-30kw with exhaust and 2 cats removed

i must be the only one here who's Aurion doesn't torque steer or if it does (which it rarely does) it's never that bad to consider it a problem

[Scooter]

Originally Posted by prasac

i have been a Ford my whole life,

i must be the only one here who's Aurion doesn't torque steer or if it does (which it rarely does) it's never that bad to consider it a problem

You have been a Ford all your life? Don't you hate it when you don't read what you write!

Anyway, I agree with torque steer comment. For that much power through the front wheels I have never found it much of a problem in my friends Presara? However you spell it (what a stupid name anyway).
Then again, it never rains in Perth and I have not driven it in wet conditions.

[Road Games]

Originally Posted by prasac

i have been a Ford my whole life, i made a decision to buy a new car. test drove a few XR6, Commondore and i ended up buying the ZR6 as it felt the best to drive and was better bang for buck, i thrash the hell out of the car at the track and street and i still get never worse than 11.5L/100km (average 10.5l) i know alot of Ford drivers that don't get anywhere near that. the Aurion's could definitely do with an exhaust, we were servicing it the other day, it was up on the hoist and i noticed how dodgy the exhaust setup is, it has 3 cats and so restrictive up near the headers, i swear it would pick-up 20-30kw with exhaust and 2 cats removed

No it wont , the camshaft profiles are designed to promote back pressure and that exhaust in std form is why you are achieving those fuel figures.. any Maxima after 2006 will float your boat as well damn they boogie off the mark !!

[xr8ted]

Originally Posted by prasac

i have been a Ford my whole life, i made a decision to buy a new car. test drove a few XR6, Commondore and i ended up buying the ZR6 as it felt the best to drive and was better bang for buck, i thrash the hell out of the car at the track and street and i still get never worse than 11.5L/100km (average 10.5l) i know alot of Ford drivers that don't get anywhere near that. the Aurion's could definitely do with an exhaust, we were servicing it the other day, it was up on the hoist and i noticed how dodgy the exhaust setup is, it has 3 cats and so restrictive up near the headers, i swear it would pick-up 20-30kw with exhaust and 2 cats removed

i must be the only one here who's Aurion doesn't torque steer or if it does (which it rarely does) it's never that bad to consider it a problem

Has the zr6 got the same tyres as the non sporty models? The Dunlop 300as on my ATX are terrible tyres. I think that good tyres would make a big difference. Mine will torque steer pretty badly even when overtaking from say 80 - 120, but once you get used to it it's not the end of the world...unless it's wet that is.