How fast was a Phase 4 GT?

[bingoTE50]

I remember being in a XT GT with a worked motor doing a 130mph and it was out of this world , that was 1979 ,considering our family car was a VC Valiant . I could not imagine what the Phase IV would have been like in 1972 for the average punter. Even going from a 200kw TE50 to a 290KW GT was pretty exciting for me , and at 240kph the GT got a bit floaty . To do 170mph in a XA would be for those with big kahunas . I would not do it. Scary stuff considering tyre & brake technology of the time.

[irish2]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

....slower than your grandmas new Toyota Aurion most likely ...certainly slower than any of the FPV turbo 6 cylinders you see sitting around the car lots these days bought by mum and dad as an easy to use family car...

"Supercars" were amazingly pitiful compared to most new stuff. It's shocking to read some of the power outputs and acceleration times that were shouted from the rooftops back then.

However, it's all relative. Keep in mind above I said "compared to new stuff". In the early to mid seventies, common foreign family cars like Corollas and Datsuns were putting out about 60kw if they were lucky. The family Kingy or Falcon was struggling to put out up to 100kw. Standard V8's were slugs as well putting out little more than 110 to maybe 120kw. Hell, even the 351 in it's final form in the Fairmont ESP Ghia was only making 126kw.
In those days, anything putting out up near 170 to 200 kw was seen as nothing less than miraculous.

With emmisions laws the corollas' of the era of the last clevos were pushing out 44kw.

Plenty of phase 3's ordered with a diff more agressive than the 3:1 the mags tested, pulled much better than a 14.4 quarter.

[pottery beige]

carb, diff and tuning my mild clevo XA GT went from 14.4 to 12.7..

and still used as a family hack.. true story...

* irrelevant post to thread.. just for the numptys that think classics are slow..*

[bionic2006xr6t]

Originally Posted by Donny

The headline of the day that killed em was 160MPH Supercars Soon..
The rev limiters in a phase 4 are easily removed, its in the rotor button, so replace that and no limiter.

That's correct if you read the extensive article they did in street fords where they interviewed the head mechanics at Jack Brabhem ford at the time (Paul Bianco) he stated that the first thing they did before putting the sole production car on the dyno (they dyno tuned all there GT-HO's before delivery) was pop the hood, pull off the dissy cap and toss the original rotor button in the bin replacing it with a standard XA GT item.

Cheers Ryan

[bullfrog]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

Hell, even the 351 in it's final form in the Fairmont ESP Ghia was only making 126kw.

Not correct.

[mik]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

....slower than your grandmas new Toyota Aurion most likely ...certainly slower than any of the FPV turbo 6 cylinders you see sitting around the car lots these days bought by mum and dad as an easy to use family car...

"Supercars" were amazingly pitiful compared to most new stuff. It's shocking to read some of the power outputs and acceleration times that were shouted from the rooftops back then.

However, it's all relative. Keep in mind above I said "compared to new stuff". In the early to mid seventies, common foreign family cars like Corollas and Datsuns were putting out about 60kw if they were lucky. The family Kingy or Falcon was struggling to put out up to 100kw. Standard V8's were slugs as well putting out little more than 110 to maybe 120kw. Hell, even the 351 in it's final form in the Fairmont ESP Ghia was only making 126kw.
In those days, anything putting out up near 170 to 200 kw was seen as nothing less than miraculous.

the GT`s still had about 500 nm of torque and weighed about as much as an au xr6, imo there`s no comparison to the tyre shredding power of the old big bangers to a modern 6 cylander family car except the ability to put power down .
add a bit of modern gearing catchup ( a 6 speed) and decent tyres these old cars would still give most of the modern factory hot rods a scare in a straight line.

[Windsor220]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

"Supercars" were amazingly pitiful compared to most new stuff. It's shocking to read some of the power outputs and acceleration times that were shouted from the rooftops back then.

Weren't the later HOs putting out about 400hp? That's almost at FPV/HSV levels now.

[2011G6E]

* XY-GTHO - 224kW
* New Toyota Aurion: 204kw.

Sorry, I was wrong, the HO did make more power...

Living in the past won't allow people to ignore the fact that while these cars were great at the time, we are lucky to live in an age where technology has meant ordinary family cars are catching up to the hero cars of decades ago...

That doesn't take away from the legend...but it does mean you have to admit that they weren't the be all and end all, the absolute pinnacle of Australian car design and performance...and for some, that's a bitter pill to swallow...

Figures like a 14.2 second quarter and 220kph top speed on 185/14 tyres are hardly startling...but they certainly were at the time.

[Windsor220]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

* XY-GTHO - 224kW
* New Toyota Aurion: 204kw.

Sorry, I was wrong, the HO did make more power...

The GTHO held the same power rating as the regular GT but it wasn't the same. Was just for insurance reasons or some other BS.

The 351 Cleveland 4V engine

torque 380 lb·ft (520 N·m) at 3400 rpm
brake horsepower
XY GT 300 bhp (224 kW; 304 PS) at 5400 rpm[3]
XY GTHO Phase III 370 - 390 bhp (276 -291 kW) at 5400 rpm[3]

And we are talking 40 years ago here.

[mik]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

* XY-GTHO - 224kW
* New Toyota Aurion: 204kw.

Sorry, I was wrong, the HO did make more power...

Living in the past won't allow people to ignore the fact that while these cars were great at the time, we are lucky to live in an age where technology has meant ordinary family cars are catching up to the hero cars of decades ago...

That doesn't take away from the legend...but it does mean you have to admit that they weren't the be all and end all, the absolute pinnacle of Australian car design and performance...and for some, that's a bitter pill to swallow...

Figures like a 14.2 second quarter and 220kph top speed on 185/14 tyres are hardly startling...but they certainly were at the time.

what the aurion puts out are not horses......they are only shetland ponies !

[gtxb67]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

but it does mean you have to admit that they weren't the be all and end all, the absolute pinnacle of Australian car design and performance...and for some, that's a bitter pill to swallow...

i get what you are trying to say, but i don't think it is coming out right

every car should be faster and better than the previous one or else the manufacturers are not doing their job
the fact that it took approximately 15-20 years for a car to be able to beat the phase 3 in a straight line proves that the phase 3 is right up there as far as the pinnacle of speed and design goes. the phase 4 would have been even better, so maybe that is the actual pinnacle. the wd40 might be there now as well, but it hasn't actually achieved anything. the phase 3 did it all on the track and street so no one in their right mind would suggest that an aurion is the pinnacle when comparing it to the phase 3. i am not sure what cars really stood out before the xrgt, but after that, you would probably have the phase 3, then the a9x and maybe the wd40. the rest are just evolutions and nothing too special in my mind and that includes the chargers. obviously i have forgotten one or maybe many, but just because a newer car is faster and more comfortable means nothing. to suggest it does is missing the point entirely

[malazn mafia]

Originally Posted by mik

what the aurion puts out are not horses......they are only shetland ponies !

not even, they are just killer-wasps just as their ad said.

[FGX-351]

GT's don't have to be better equiped than modern cars.
They're equipped with a character most modern cars will never come close to having.

[Blue Roo]

I'm surprised that Roy from Street Fords hasn't picked up on this Thread yet. He's quiet knowageable about the Phase 4.

[SteveJH]

Werent both a standard modern XR6 and a GT-HO Phase 3 tested around Mount Panorama a couple of years ago? The XR6 was faster, despite much less engine power.

[mik]

Originally Posted by SteveJH

Werent both a standard modern XR6 and a GT-HO Phase 3 tested around Mount Panorama a couple of years ago? The XR6 was faster, despite much less engine power.

from memory it was a little faster around the track, but not due to straight line speed, , it was due 40 years of tyre,brake,suspension improvements, and unless i`m mistaken to add insult to injury the the gt was running 10 or 20 year old tyres, fair test? i don`t think so.

[Oxa384]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

* XY-GTHO - 224kW
* New Toyota Aurion: 204kw.

Sorry, I was wrong, the HO did make more power...

Living in the past won't allow people to ignore the fact that while these cars were great at the time, we are lucky to live in an age where technology has meant ordinary family cars are catching up to the hero cars of decades ago...

That doesn't take away from the legend...but it does mean you have to admit that they weren't the be all and end all, the absolute pinnacle of Australian car design and performance...and for some, that's a bitter pill to swallow...

Figures like a 14.2 second quarter and 220kph top speed on 185/14 tyres are hardly startling...but they certainly were at the time.

NO RESPECT

[gcg2503]

Originally Posted by oxa384

NO RESPECT

I couldn't care less if someone likes or hates XAs

But to bag a car you know nothing about really irks me

185 tyres?

No they were ER7014s.....205s......On a standard XA GT

Bigger tyres on 15x7 globes on the phase 4

300hp? No try north of 370-380hp

Do the research first, then talk

Last time I checked the op wanted to know what the top speed of the phase 4 was

Not to hear how it compares to an Aurion..wtf

[xbxd351]

I have noticed a lot of arrogance amongst drivers of late models cars but it doesn't last long when they get hosed off by old school muscle

[XAGSV8]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

..
In those days, anything putting out up near 170 to 200 kw was seen as nothing less than miraculous.

Here are the specs for a 302 V8 in the XA.

302ci V8:
Capacity: 302 cubic inches (4.95 litres)
Type: Conventional, watercooled four stroke, reciprocating piston type with 8 cylinders in vee
Configuration: Front mounted, longitudinal, inline
Head: Pushrod and rocker actuated ohv with two valves per cylinder
Fuel System: Two barrel carburettor
Bore and Stroke: 4.00 x 3.00 inches (102 x 76mm)
Power: 240bhp (179kw) at 5000rpm
Torque: 305lb-ft (414Nm) at 2600rpm
Compression Ratio: 9.5:1

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

... The family Kingy or Falcon was struggling to put out up to 100kw. Standard V8's were slugs as well putting out little more than 110 to maybe 120kw.

The 250ci 2V Six was putting out 127kw in the XA.

http://www.uniquecarsandparts.com.au...ifications.htm

[flappist]

ENOUGH.

Keep it on topic and not personal or argumentative.

There will be no alerts.

[XAGSV8]

Originally Posted by Blue Roo

I'm surprised that Roy from Street Fords hasn't picked up on this Thread yet. He's quiet knowageable about the Phase 4.

Hey Roy, would love to hear your thoughts as well as I can see you lurking. Also if you don't mind me asking any word on the DVD and book?

[HP-0351]

Originally Posted by Blue Roo

I'm surprised that Roy from Street Fords hasn't picked up on this Thread yet. He's quiet knowageable about the Phase 4.

Just saw it as I've been away in Country NSW.

Re top speed its a little hard to put an accurate number on it but I will say it that it WILL be faster overall than a Phase 3.

This is based on my own personal experience driving a Phase 3 that made 373hp and 377 lb.ft on the engine dyno, paired with a close ratio top loader, 3.25 gears and 15x7 globe wheels with 215/60/15 tyres

Vs

The 'sole production' Phase 4, which made 383hp and 364 lb.ft on the engine dyno (same engine dyno Street Fords issue 66), paired with the same top loader but with 3.00 gears and the same wheel/tyre combo.

With the rev limiters (6,150rpm for the Phase 3, 6,200rpm for the Phase 4)on both cars temporarily disconnected, the Phase 3 was a quick car as it runs through the gears. As you get to the upper rpm of around 6,000rpm you feel it starting to nose over. The Phase 4 at the same rpm is begging for more road with no sign of nosing over...

This isn't due only to the extra 10hp but more so due to the slightly 'factory ported' heads around the intake valve, it is unshrouded and the intake and exhaust port runners are lightly smoothed.

The 3.00 gears do help but I can tell you that after driving them back to back, the Phase 4 WILL outrun a Phase 3, its not like night and day but it is clear to see. As mentioned already the XA body is sleeker and also is a contributor...

I'm longing to put it to the test one day (on the quarter mile, same day, same driver etc) when the owner grants me my wish

Cheers

[Auslandau]

There is a few things I will throw in ..... couple of cents worth.

To so many, it is not the fact that a modern "whatever" today car can beat these era of cars around the track or in a straight line. None what so ever and no-one will deny the fact that (Thankfully) daily cars are quicker than all GT's produced. It's a mute point

It is what they were at the time ..... the fastest 4 door production car, a car that won Bathurst & can be driven from the race to the road, was affordable in the segment it competed in, was the hero car of the day (month, year), was the catlyist to start the 160mph poo that strangled the Australian segment (when any euro worth triple could still be bought at the time). It is also important in the present ......... it was limited in number, has a GREAT note, is GREAT to drive, is a GREAT toy, they smell, you need two hands to drive them ..... and people look at them even when they are sitting still and go WOW ..... "I remember when ....... " Throw in the Phase IV into the mix ......

Those that do not like, know nothing about, do not understand can go and talk about Camry's, Skylines or whatevers elsewhere till their little heart is content.

Don't poo on what it was to most of the crowd in here. It is a Ford ......

AND JUST IN CASE ....... This is not a figment of anyones imagination.

[Nikked]

The story behind that phase 4's life is as amazing as the lore that surrounds it...

[HP-0351]

By the way I revealed that pic out of my personal archive and into Street Fords years ago

Good to see its still getting 'used' albeit without copyright permission... ;)

[Auslandau]

Is on this site ..... might be your site?
http://www.gtho4.com/

Photo in this site credits Source : www.fordforums.com.au on this site .... http://www.gtho4.com/Phase-4-Calypso-Green.html

Back to topic now .............

[HP-0351]

Originally Posted by Auslandau

Is on this site ..... might be your site?
http://www.gtho4.com/

Photo in this site credits Source : www.fordforums.com.au on this site .... http://www.gtho4.com/Phase-4-Calypso-Green.html

Back to topic now .............

That's because that pic is mine as seen for the first time in my column in SF.

It was then SCANNED from the magazine and then posted on AFF and on that site.

The owner of the site will not reply to my emails to change the Source to Roy Velardi Street Fords Magazine...understand now? All good just thought I'd point that out...

[G6E Turbo 2]

Originally Posted by gcg2503

I couldn't care less if someone likes or hates XAs

But to bag a car you know nothing about really irks me

185 tyres?

No they were ER7014s.....205s......On a standard XA GT

Bigger tyres on 15x7 globes on the phase 4

300hp? No try north of 370-380hp

Do the research first, then talk

Last time I checked the op wanted to know what the top speed of the phase 4 was

Not to hear how it compares to an Aurion..wtf

I Agree , I owned a fantastic Factory Standard XA GT 4 Dr manual with several RPO bits on it
at 130MPH across Hawkesbury River bridge it was a bit scary
but what a machine !!!!!!!

I also drove it around the Bathurst track on GT Nationals weekend early 90's flat out for about 45 minutes with a mate in his white XA GT following. I have no Idea how they raced them for 1000 klms at that sort of pace

Those were the days !!!!!!!!!! Cars with character and Balls !!!!!!!
Nothing will ever replace a GT Falcon

[Stefan]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

Figures like a 14.2 second quarter and 220kph top speed on 185/14 tyres are hardly startling...but they certainly were at the time.

Funny thing is up until the supercharged V8, the GTs with a Boss 290 /302 /315 are struggling to do mid 14s with a journo behind the wheel.

One thing you're forgetting is a little thing called torque.

A saying of old "horsepower sells cars, torque moves them".