Whats stopping people from buying the Falcon?

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by prydey

do you stop to think that perhaps out of the thousands of cars they sell, there is only a small handful that are like you? they are running a business. why produce cars that are only selling to an absolute minority. given that they are the ones selling the cars, i'd imagine they have just a little bit more data on that subject than you have.

Thats true, but what I said is why can't they have it as an OPTION? If someone wants that option, they can wait a few months to have the exact car they want made up and delivered. How can that hurt the business by offering something that maybe a few people might want?

I work in manufacturing and if our customer wants something, no matter how different it is to our production vehicles we do anything in our power to deliver their car with exactly what they want.

I'd happily wait 6 months for the car with everything I actually want it to have.

I've got a great idea! How about HIDs standard across the range, as if you'd have halogen reflectors on cars in this day and age, at the very least it should be halogen projectors, then maybe HID as an option.

Instead of wasting money on LPG, they could have spent the same money on diesel instead, everyone seems to favor diesel rather than LPG, which has the image of being crappy to drive, backfiring etc (never let the facts get in the way of a good story), I don't think 95% of people would give a rats *** about some whizz-bang LPI LPG system, they see LPG and assume crap. Also the variance between servos in the quality of LPG, you might be lucky and have all the stars aligned, a full moon during a leap year to get the same decent batch twice in a row.

Its all about perception, not capability.

Or lets cut the crap and stop making the Falcon all together and actually design and produce cars people actually want to buy?

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Joe5619

Was the paper add a Ford one or dealer one?
.

Doesn't matter the result is the same...

[MercuryT]

Advertising is great for future sales, but you need spare money to advertise! Money that is paying off debts cant be used for advertising, or else Ford would be in more trouble.

Seems very short-sighted (almost naive) to suggest Ford should be "advertising" a car that is completely dead in the water (unfortunately) and plans are already under way for a different direction for "Falcon".

[prydey]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

produce cars people actually want to buy?

i've never understood what people mean when they make this comment! enlighten me. and whats your fetish with headlights? when it comes to light, the new projectors are rubbish compared to what they replaced.

so to make the falcon a car that people want, do they need to cut it in half? make it the size of a small car? do they need to jack it up and make it a suv/4wd?

the falcon is arguably the best in its class. not sure what else you want from it.

i think people are upset that their life circumstances, whether financial or otherwise, stop them from buying the falcon, so they have to try to justify their position by rubbishing falcon. they try to blame ford and falcon as to why there isn't one in their driveway. many people still want falcon to be the 'one size fits all' car. well it isn't and won't be again. thems the facts. want a ford wagon, buy mondeo or territory. want a ford ute. buy a ranger.

[Auslandau]

Gotta agree Big Damo ..... am a bit over that statement. They have a perfectly good car sitting there in the Falcon/G Series/FPV Series and with all the other offerings available in so many spec levels and technology ....... people still pull that one out. LPG, Petrol, deisel, turbo, supercharged, 4, 6, 8, RWD, FWD, wagons, 4X4, Euro spec mid size, large, ute .... and absolutely etc.

I suppose a V12 with heated seats, 'special' head lights, HO badge and AWD is what people want these days as that seems to be the only thing missing.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

Advertising is great for future sales, but you need spare money to advertise! Money that is paying off debts cant be used for advertising, or else Ford would be in more trouble.

Seems very short-sighted (almost naive) to suggest Ford should be "advertising" a car that is completely dead in the water (unfortunately) and plans are already under way for a different direction for "Falcon".

Go back a step, delays in development of EcoLPI meant a +12 month gap in servicing a fleet need,
let's give Ford a chance to win back those fleet sales and the complementary Ecoboost
model adding to four cylinder fleets as well as attracting a new group of Falcon buyers..

December and January are always "nothing doing" months for Falcon and now that discounts are here,
we will soon see if Ford's expectations of Falcon and Territory sales bouncing back is happening or not.

There's still four years od E8 to run, Ford needs to make that car work in the present and develop towards
the 2016 car, whatever that vehicle becomes...

[MercuryT]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Go back a step, delays in development of EcoLPI meant a +12 month gap in servicing a fleet need,
let's give Ford a chance to win back those fleet sales and the complementary Ecoboost
model adding to four cylinder fleets as well as attracting a new group of Falcon buyers..

December and January are always "nothing doing" months for Falcon and now that discounts are here,
we will soon see if Ford's expectations of Falcon and Territory sales bouncing back is happening or not.

There's still four years od E8 to run, Ford needs to make that car work in the present and develop towards
the 2016 car, whatever that vehicle becomes...

All the above makes sense mate.

But its my opinion that the decision has already been made (not yet public) that Aussie built Falcon is dead. Hence the lack of any sort of direction/advertising etc, so they aren't bothering spending more money making an already failed product "work" (rightly or wrongly).

They will promote the new car when ford announce their new direction.

[weairy]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

Whilst I 100% agree about the ignorance angle (another is how people buy BMWs for the "ultimate driving machine", then think a 318i will provide that and brag about their (rubbish) "sports saloon".....ha ha) it is fair to a degree the original comment the guy made about never buying a 4cyl Falcon.

I love the sound of cars and gives me driving enjoyment (place it more important than speed), and i've never heard a good sounding 4 - ever. Closest is a WRX and I still think its lame. So I agree with original comment, I wouldnt even test drive a Falcon 4 because I already know it wouldnt suit what im looking for.

Thank you Mercury; more or less the point I was getting across with more words. If I wanted to buy an econimical 4cyl family car, I'd look at a Mazda or similar (which seems to be the thinking of many buyers based on the sales figures for the Mazda 3). But I want a car with a nice little grumble that'll upset some other P Platers in their SV6s when I stomp the foot down. Again; that personal (and yes, fair enough, ignorant) opinion.

[weairy]

And just to throw fuel on a bushfire; I think the LPG idea isn't a bad one for an Aussie car; we have a big supply of the stuff here...

If only they'd start doing the old Arab trick and tap it off, keep it here and sell it to the rest of the world in spits and farts for a high price, rather than firesaling another of our resources for 2c a litre.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

All the above makes sense mate.

But its my opinion that the decision has already been made (not yet public) that Aussie built Falcon is dead.

By now they have the business plan submitted with their preferred vehicle(s) and that does not mean
it will be a FWD/AWD platform, a lot hinges on what China needs in terms of a large car design....

Hence the lack of any sort of direction/advertising etc, so they aren't bothering spending more money making an already failed product "work" (rightly or wrongly).

One doesn't follow from the other...Ford have spent money and delivered on MCA
and will do MCB in around two years time, they are committed to making Falcon work..
True lack of confidence would be reflected in no updates whatsoever,
like the Crown Victoria...

They will promote the new car when ford announce their new direction.

I have a feeling that evolution is still a better (cheaper) bet than tearing up everything...

[dallasv8]

places like Mt Isa Ford dont help sales.
at the moment there are 2 fords on the floor,a fiesta and an xr6.there was a ranger there last week but its gone now.part of the problem is Ford and Nissan out there are in the same shop,theres a whole host of nissans on the floor with no room to put falcons.
Hsv and holden have a good share of it as well as there are a whole host of cars on the floor.you can walk in and buy a maloo off the floor.to buy an Fpv you need to go 1000km away.
hell, to buy a G6 you need to drive 1000km!

[MercuryT]

Originally Posted by jpd80

I have a feeling that evolution is still a better (cheaper) bet than tearing up everything...

If Evolution was better for the company Ford would be selling Falcons now. They aren't, and it will only get worse.

A large car needs to be exceptional to prosper in the market, or be a SUV, 4wd or whatever. The Falcon is neither, its a good honest family car. That used to be enough, not in the 20th century. (disregarding performance models which are exceptional)

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

If Evolution was better for the company Ford would be selling Falcons now. They aren't, and it will only get worse.

It costs a lot of money to wind up local production, that's why the V6 was cancelled,
it was less costly to do the changes to I-6 and forget the global engine...

A large car needs to be exceptional to prosper in the market, or be a SUV, 4wd or whatever. The Falcon is neither, its a good honest family car. That used to be enough, not in the 20th century. (disregarding performance models which are exceptional)

The Falcon can no longer be everything to everyone but look at the breadth of product:
Falcon sedan, EcoLPI, Ecoboost, Ute, Territory - it's not just Falcon sedan, it's Territory and Ute too...

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

A large car needs to be exceptional to prosper in the market, or be a SUV, 4wd or whatever. The Falcon is neither, its a good honest family car. That used to be enough, not in the 20th century. (disregarding performance models which are exceptional)

Exceptional???? Take a look at the top 10 and in my consideration they are all unexceptional. The Cruze is NOT an exceptional vehicle, neither the C'dore nor the Mazda for that matter ..... they are washing machines on wheels. And so is the XT Falcon and hopefully the Falcon 4 Cylinder will be a more popular appliance than the others. Better, exceptional, whatever, means nothing ..... if it did FORD would be killing it.

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Doesn't matter the result is the same...

Yes it does, it show a late of commitment by Ford, if it is left to the dealers to do there advertising! And the dealers money could be better spent improving their dealership, not doing Ford’s advertising for them!!


A car might be sold, just the same, but the bigger picture is very different IMO.

[markvd]

Originally Posted by 12paul12

Man what are on, I want some!

its the pheromones that are in the Holden, artificially imsemernatered. Thats why they sell.

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

All the above makes sense mate.

But its my opinion that the decision has already been made (not yet public) that Aussie built Falcon is dead. Hence the lack of any sort of direction/advertising etc, so they aren't bothering spending more money making an already failed product "work" (rightly or wrongly).

They will promote the new car when ford announce their new direction.

I'm glad you’re not running the company I work for. Even if the decision has been made to drop Falcon, it is still 4 years away. Doing nothing to try & sell the car your building for the next 4 years is very very very bad management. And I personally do not think Ford Aust has bad management!!

[markvd]

VW is gaining ground in the Taxi ranks here in Brisbane. Who would have thought.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Joe5619

Yes it does, it show a late of commitment by Ford, if it is left to the dealers to do there advertising! And the dealers money could be better spent improving their dealership, not doing Ford’s advertising for them!!


A car might be sold, just the same, but the bigger picture is very different IMO.

It's a national ad campaign so I'd say Ford spent the cash , provided the low cost cars to dealers...
It is a partnership between Ford and dealers, it's not like one is doing all the lifting.

[1TUFFUTE]

for starters im sick of hearing thick people who think falcon needs the latest tech in headlights...whatever that is..halogen..smallogen or whatever...do me a favour an go ask your brother , father son mother and your mum and sister what headlights are in the latest cars...if they get it right ill by you a BENTLEY...ALL OF YOU.
Heres a free one for use...the current falcon you can buy in showrooms has been voted the safest and best second hand car you can buy in australia....FACT

[atmoxr6]

easiest way to stop every one from bitching that falcon doesn't do this, hasn't got that, should be like this, or be a copy of the commodore. ford should just drop every name from fiesta to territory, and call everything a ford hatch/sedan/wagon. How many people that complain about the falcon actually drive one later than an eb/d/f/l? or a falcon at all?

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by jpd80

It's a national ad campaign so I'd say Ford spent the cash , provided the low cost cars to dealers...
It is a partnership between Ford and dealers, it's not like one is doing all the lifting.

Agreed, but Ford should be doing the heavy lifting..

[johnydep]

Originally Posted by Auslandau

Exceptional???? Take a look at the top 10 and in my consideration they are all unexceptional. The Cruze is NOT an exceptional vehicle, neither the C'dore nor the Mazda for that matter ..... they are washing machines on wheels. And so is the XT Falcon and hopefully the Falcon 4 Cylinder will be a more popular appliance than the others. Better, exceptional, whatever, means nothing ..... if it did FORD would be killing it.

I think MercuryT was making the point "A large car needs to be exceptional to prosper in the market..".

Probably due to the stats pointing out that new private buyers are flocking to small and medium cars, and SUV and 4WD vehicles.

Originally Posted by MercuryT

If Evolution was better for the company Ford would be selling Falcons now. They aren't, and it will only get worse.

A large car needs to be exceptional to prosper in the market, or be a SUV, 4wd or whatever. The Falcon is neither, its a good honest family car. That used to be enough, not in the 20th century. (disregarding performance models which are exceptional)

[MercuryT]

Originally Posted by johnydep

I think MercuryT was making the point "A large car needs to be exceptional to prosper in the market..".

Probably due to the stats pointing out that new private buyers are flocking to small and medium cars, and SUV and 4WD vehicles.

Thats the exact point I was making mate, thanks.

As for the "glad you aren't running my company" comment later on Joe, you claim Ford "doesnt have bad management", yet they have managed to stuff nearly everything up for the last 10 years?

Most importantly not even having a Falcon wagon to match the Sportswagon and even have a competitor (Territory and Captiva are different/suvs, which is why Holden Sportswagon has been quite successful - just like how more buyers get a Liberty in wagon over sedan)

[Brazen]

I think local Ford manufacturing will be here for quite a while to come.

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

for starters im sick of hearing thick people who think falcon needs the latest tech in headlights...whatever that is..halogen..smallogen or whatever...do me a favour an go ask your brother , father son mother and your mum and sister what headlights are in the latest cars...if they get it right ill by you a BENTLEY...ALL OF YOU.
Heres a free one for use...the current falcon you can buy in showrooms has been voted the safest and best second hand car you can buy in australia....FACT

Whilst i can agree somewhat with your post, as i posted earlier when i bought my Focus i wanted stuff like Xenon lights, they look great and work even better (Better then the standard ones anyway)

I think you have added another reason why the falcon doesnt sell. I have highlighted the point.

Buying one second hand is a much more viable option then new for most people.

[onfire]

If high-end national level commercial advertising isn't a option due to monetary restrictions, attack on the grass-root level.

Everyone knows they can walk into a dealership and go for a test drive. But, sometimes you need to push people, or draw people in -- " EVERY SATURDAY COME DOWN AND DRIVE THE NEW FG mkII! " make it a national requirement that all dealers run this in the local papers, every week instead a spraying the words COYOTE V8! and what not, appealing to that very small minority that would actually purchase a FPV -- who, mind you would sort after the GT themselves.

Once people do start rolling in, don't just tell them what they need to know -- show them, put them in the drivers seat asap and let them drive the car. Really make the day special.

It's about push.

Now, we're just getting into the hypothetical.

[BAFrod]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

If Evolution was better for the company Ford would be selling Falcons now. They aren't, and it will only get worse.

A large car needs to be exceptional to prosper in the market, or be a SUV, 4wd or whatever. The Falcon is neither, its a good honest family car. That used to be enough, not in the 20th century. (disregarding performance models which are exceptional)

*cough* 21st??

[MercuryT]

Originally Posted by BAFrod

*cough* 21st??

Good pick up. Im only a little behind, just 100 years.....ha ha

[Gobes32]

I haven't bought a new Falcon because I can't afford it, simple as that. In fact, I can't afford any new car. That is why I drive an EL and my wife has an AU2 wagon (which is a brilliant car fwiw). Until my mortgage comes down to a more sane level, I, like many of our friends, am going to hold onto our older cars and put every spare cent we have into our homes. I wonder how many other people are doing the same.