FGX XR6 Vs VF SV6 and the winner is ???? - Page 3

vztrt · 26-01-2018, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

Really I would have an LSA over any Ford engine, the Turbo is good but god why do they sweat and leak so much oil? and I think there is more to a car than just an engine and unfortunately thats the only thing going for the Ford. I do prefer the look of the FG mk2 front facia than my VF, the VF is more grown up. Why does the inside seem better suited to a 7yo?? doesn't make sense!!! The inside is better suited to a BMW or Mercedes Driver because its sooo nice!

You can get a lsa in a commodore?
The engine does make a car. The turbo is brilliant. Mine always been good. No oil leaking from them. Not the other 4 i6 motors I've had.

The interior is suited to someone of the mentality of a 7yo.

williamisenuf · 26-01-2018, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

You can get a lsa in a commodore?
The engine does make a car. The turbo is brilliant. Mine always been good. No oil leaking from them. Not the other 4 i6 motors I've had.

The interior is suited to someone of the mentality of a 7yo.

Never heard of a HSV lol, The falcon interior is suited to an 80 year old because it reminds them of the Good Ol Days hahaha!

Trump · 26-01-2018, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

I don't think you have driven a VF, Sounds like you drove a LE0 VE ****box which makes sense on the way you are describing it. My VF LFX V6 is quieter than my old Barra i6 and has much more power, I know because I raced my cousin who bought my old FG with the ZF and I smashed him several times! If the V6 is so bad why would have I bought it after having 2 Barra i6 Falcons? My uncle who use to work at Ford building the Barra's says that the V6 in the VF is a much superior engine to the Falcons Barra! The 6L45 transmission drives just as well as the ZF and much more responsive in Manual mode! So don't knock it until you actually drive an LFX engine. If u did drive a VF I bet it was an Evoke with the smaller 3.0ltr engine not the SV6 3.6 LFX

I have had both VE and VF's as company cars as V6's (in both capacities) and the engines have been horrible things to live with. Both variants in either series were noisy pieces of crap and every single one of them had timing chain issues. They did not have a single redeeming feature about them. I just don't know how they managed to turn an epic design on paper into something so bad.

williamisenuf · 26-01-2018, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trump

I have had both VE and VF's as company cars as V6's (in both capacities) and the engines have been horrible things to live with. Both variants in either series were noisy pieces of crap and every single one of them had timing chain issues. They did not have a single redeeming feature about them. I just don't know how they managed to turn an epic design on paper into something so bad.

No dude timing chain issues were only VE pre SIDI, the VE is noisy and I agree that they are a piece of **** engine but the VF is a completely different motor and is just as quiet as a Barra i6 if not quieter! I highly doubt u drove a VF! I cant even here my VF idle once its warmed up! As company cars you would have had fleet Omegas and Evokes!

Trump · 26-01-2018, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

No dude timing chain issues were only VE pre SIDI, the VE is noisy and I agree that they are a piece of **** engine but the VF is a completely different motor and is just as quiet as a Barra i6 if not quieter! I highly doubt u drove a VF! I cant even here my VF idle once its warmed up! As company cars you would have had fleet Omegas and Evokes!

Dude, every single one of my work hacks has had the timing chain assembly replaced, and they have been a spread of Evoke's, Omega's and Calais'.

Regarding your Falcon ownership, you must have either bought abused examples or neglected them. It takes a hell of a lot to have a B-series and onwards six cylinder Falcon carry on as you describe (unless it's on gas, but we won't go there

).

hackney · 26-01-2018, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trump

I have had both VE and VF's as company cars as V6's (in both capacities) and the engines have been horrible things to live with. Both variants in either series were noisy pieces of crap and every single one of them had timing chain issues. They did not have a single redeeming feature about them. I just don't know how they managed to turn an epic design on paper into something so bad.

Have to completely agree,there is no comparison between the Holden V6 & the I6 Motor.It has always been a superior engine(I6)in all respects.These Barra engines are right up there with the Nissan RB,Toyota JZ & BMW S54 in terms of performance & tunability.Cheers

williamisenuf · 26-01-2018, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hackney

Have to completely agree,there is no comparison between the Holden V6 & the I6 Motor.It has always been a superior engine(I6)in all respects.These Barra engines are right up there with the Nissan RB,Toyota JZ & BMW S54 in terms of performance & tunability.Cheers

Yeah the turbo is good but the standard i6 is crap and a paperweight!

williamisenuf · 26-01-2018, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trump

Dude, every single one of my work hacks has had the timing chain assembly replaced, and they have been a spread of Evoke's, Omega's and Calais'.

Regarding your Falcon ownership, you must have either bought abused examples or neglected them. It takes a hell of a lot to have a B-series and onwards six cylinder Falcon carry on as you describe (unless it's on gas, but we won't go there

).

My BF had 110,000km on it when I got it and my FG had 2,000km demo model and they were both the same! Not neglected!

VF don’t have timing chain issues man I think you are getting confused.

Mercury Bullet · 26-01-2018, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

My BF had 110,000km on it when I got it and my FG had 2,000km demo model and they were both the same! Not neglected!

VF don’t have timing chain issues man I think you are getting confused.

Dude
IF you had rough idling issues you could trace it directly to your aftermarket lpg.

Should have bought an ecolpi.
Oops it has moar power and torque.

Trump · 26-01-2018, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

My BF had 110,000km on it when I got it and my FG had 2,000km demo model and they were both the same! Not neglected!

VF don’t have timing chain issues man I think you are getting confused.

The Calais I handed over when I left employment was a 2014 V6 and it went in to get the timing chain assembly replaced two months before I finished up. The service advisor mentioned that the timing chain issues weren't as common as they were on the VE, but they still got a lot in with the problem.

**buggerlugs** · 26-01-2018, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trump

The Calais I handed over when I left employment was a 2014 V6 and it went in to get the timing chain assembly replaced two months before I finished up. The service advisor mentioned that the timing chain issues weren't as common as they were on the VE, but they still got a lot in with the problem.

Seriously thou Dude, I highly doubt you have ever driven a VF.....

Mercury Bullet · 26-01-2018, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

Dude I have had 2 Barra Falcons for over 5 years and they idle like a pig! You guys are comparing both cars but never actually owned both! I have!
If you sit at the lights for more than 30 seconds the engine feels like a tractor, yes i6 engines should run smoother but in this case they just don't! The Barra engine is outdated by 20 years! Japanese cars have had the same technology Decades ago! Good thing Ford brought out the Ecoboost and I can recall them saying the Ecoboost falcon is much better than the Big i6? Doesn't the Ecoboost have direct injection? And i would rather get a valve cleaning every now and then, at least my Diff and diff bushes don't need to be replaced every 6 months! The thing I hated in every post BA Falcon is when you are driving hard then release the throttle and a massive BANG the diff slaps something horrendous even from Brand new even off the showroom floor! The Falcon would have been a much better car if it was better built, Ford cared about quality and just the overall Refinement because the falcon has no refinement what so ever!
If there is such a big difference in Torque why does the falcon loose 0-100 compared to the VF? and explain to me why I have people in the Falcon you can feel the power difference, feels sluggish on WOT! In the VF cant even tell they are there! Oh and double check because the latest High end Euros are going V6 Twin Turbo , just like the GTR!

Dude, you edited your post....

I drive my car on the speed limiter quite often and NEVER once have I heard a noise from the diff. The biggest problem with them is they aerate the oil at high speeds and breathe.

How many did you go through?
For someone who keeps tugging at the wheel on full lock, I'd guess a few?

hackney · 26-01-2018, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

Yeah the turbo is good but the standard i6 is crap and a paperweight!

And you have this on good authority(of course you don’t) and evidence attached?Sorry,but the V6 Holden has never been in the hunt,even with it’s “improvements”(Why also you think the taxi industry used them over the Holden.)Iwill leave you with it. Cheers

williamisenuf · 26-01-2018, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hackney

And you have this on good authority(of course you don’t) and evidence attached?Sorry,but the V6 Holden has never been in the hunt,even with it’s “improvements”(Why also you think the taxi industry used them over the Holden.)Iwill leave you with it. Cheers

Dude for a start my uncle built Barra i6’s at Ford! I am not talking about old Holden’s! Why du guys keep bringing them up! I am talking about FG vs VF! Not many of either were used at Taxis! Most taxis were Camry’s by that stage!

Old commodore V6 were ****! But the Latest SIDI are completly different engines and are superior to Barra i6’s!

williamisenuf · 26-01-2018, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mercury Bullet

Dude, you edited your post....

I drive my car on the speed limiter quite often and NEVER once have I heard a noise from the diff. The biggest problem with them is they aerate the oil at high speeds and breathe.

How many did you go through?
For someone who keeps tugging at the wheel on full lock, I'd guess a few?

all falcons have diff slap when you drop off the power! U obviously drive like a old woman!

**Ross 1** · 26-01-2018, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

I cant even here my VF idle once its warmed up!

I agree, I couldn't hear anything over the cabin noise as soon as the VF was at 25km/h and above.

hackney · 26-01-2018, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

all falcons have diff slap when you drop off the power! U obviously drive like a old woman!

Again,complete “BS” I have owned a lot of Falcons(ECOLPI,Ecoboost, standard Barra) & I do not drive like an “old Woman”.Your Uncles opinion is his & his alone.(he would be in the miniority.)As far as taxis go,there is still quite a few Falcons running around.Even BEFORE Camry started getting into the fleet,nobody used Commodore.As far as you saying they are “paper weight” again a lot of “BS”.Falcon has more torque,391nm against 353nm(my old Ecoboost had the same as the Commodore) Kw? Falcon 195, run it on “98” & it is 210kw,same as Commodore,it will still pull stronger than a Commodore.Go to the Ecolpi 210kw & 409nm,again NO contest!Think you should go over to the Holden Forums & Stay there.) & yes I have driven a VF, thx but no thx.Cheers

Trump · 26-01-2018, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

Dude for a start my uncle built Barra i6’s at Ford! I am not talking about old Holden’s! Why du guys keep bringing them up! I am talking about FG vs VF! Not many of either were used at Taxis! Most taxis were Camry’s by that stage!

Old commodore V6 were ****! But the Latest SIDI are completly different engines and are superior to Barra i6’s!

As I (and others) have said, the HFV6 on paper is an epic engine. In reality, it isn't any better than the Mootec Buick engine it replaced. You can't use your two obviously faulty examples of the "Barra" engine as a comparison to the V6. I've owned a naturally aspirated BA and I have video of a balanced 50c piece on the rocker cover it idled that smoothly. It put down 166rwkW on a tightass dyno and revved happily to its 6000rpm redline. Is it typical of a Barra engine, probably not, but it illustrates how inherently balanced and smooth the engine was.

williamisenuf · 26-01-2018, 02:36 PM

Ok I am not replying on this again because it’s hard to have a solid argument when it seems the people in this tread are just too “Brand Loyal” and can’t see pass the oval badge! Because I am a Ford guy too and have had experience with both and just stating my ownership review on both cars and I know for a fact the commodore is a better car overall by my own experience!

williamisenuf · 26-01-2018, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hackney

Again,complete “BS” I have owned a lot of Falcons(ECOLPI,Ecoboost, standard Barra) & I do not drive like an “old Woman”.Your Uncles opinion is his & his alone.(he would be in the miniority.)As far as taxis go,there is still quite a few Falcons running around.Even BEFORE Camry started getting into the fleet,nobody used Commodore.Cheers

j

Taxis before Camry dude again I am not talking about back then! I am talking about now! All have diff slap normal characteristic of the IRS setup with the diff cradle! Go out now and floor it down the road then drop you foot off the power and it will go bang!

Mercury Bullet · 26-01-2018, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

all falcons have diff slap when you drop off the power! U obviously drive like a old woman!

Only yours it seems, and you never asked for a replacement?

Race you to breakfast, my roads. Bring ur poopa scoopa........

**redxm** · 26-01-2018, 02:42 PM

The acronym SIDI is dumb marketing. Spark Ignition. like its a new thing. Maybe its so you can tell the difference from a Cruze diesel (they both sound the same)

Trump · 26-01-2018, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

Ok I am not replying on this again because it’s hard to have a solid argument when it seems the people in this tread are just too “Brand Loyal” and can’t see pass the oval badge! Because I am a Ford guy too and have had experience with both and just stating my ownership review on both cars and I know for a fact the commodore is a better car overall by my own experience!

It isn't an argument about brand loyalty. A V8-equipped VF/VF2 is an epic beast, moreso the VF2 with the LS3. I've owned a manual VF SS and I loved it. It wasn't as fast as my FG XR6T was but stock for stock, it handled far better than the FG did.

As I said earlier, you can't let your crappy examples tar all atmo Barra engines with the same brush. Go drive an EcoLPi version and then compare.

williamisenuf · 26-01-2018, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trump

It isn't an argument about brand loyalty. A V8-equipped VF/VF2 is an epic beast, moreso the VF2 with the LS3. I've owned a manual VF SS and I loved it. It wasn't as fast as my FG XR6T was but stock for stock, it handled far better than the FG did.

As I said earlier, you can't let your crappy examples tar all atmo Barra engines with the same brush. Go drive an EcoLPi version and then compare.

Dude I like Turbo i6’s got nothing against them I am soly comparing apples for apples Barra 195 vs GM LFX and FG vs VF! Not sure why turbos got into the subject! And having 2x Barra NA engines I much prefer the V6 LFX engine as I believe it’s much better!

The Turbo isn’t an NA engine therefore I am not talking about that!

williamisenuf · 26-01-2018, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mercury Bullet

Only yours it seems, and you never asked for a replacement?

Race you to breakfast, my roads. Bring ur poopa scoopa........

All falcons do it man! It’s like saying ur doesn’t need petrol! All falcon Sedas do it!

hackney · 26-01-2018, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

Taxis before Camry dude again I am not talking about back then! I am talking about now! All have diff slap normal characteristic of the IRS setup with the diff cradle! Go out now and floor it down the road then drop you foot off the power and it will go bang!

Again,”BS” has never done it as you described.

hackney · 26-01-2018, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trump

It isn't an argument about brand loyalty. A V8-equipped VF/VF2 is an epic beast, moreso the VF2 with the LS3. I've owned a manual VF SS and I loved it. It wasn't as fast as my FG XR6T was but stock for stock, it handled far better than the FG did.

As I said earlier, you can't let your crappy examples tar all atmo Barra engines with the same brush. Go drive an EcoLPi version and then compare.

Yes,indeed.Commodore is not even in the same room(it is dismal against a Ecolpi)Cheers

williamisenuf · 26-01-2018, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hackney

Again,”BS” has never done it as you described.

The only thing BS is you man! Everyone on this site who has a sedan knows about diff slap because they experience it everyday.

Mercury Bullet · 26-01-2018, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

All falcons do it man! It’s like saying ur doesn’t need petrol! All falcon Sedas do it!

No they don't....dude.

What you are describing isn't diff slap and why didn't you get your diff bush replaced?

hackney · 26-01-2018, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by williamisenuf

The only thing BS is you man! Everyone on this site who has a sedan knows about diff slap because they experience it everyday.

Again,you are full of it.