Petrol Price crisis......

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

That always amazes me when I go to Sydney, went to a restaurant in Merrylands, parked out the back of a Maccas and there was an absolutely massive apartment tower overlooking Maccas and the restaurant - there had to be 100+ apartments in it.

I'd hazard guess because of Sydney real estate prices thats going to be lots of peoples only options and thats why those developments are popular across the whole metropolitan area.

They are built for cheap affordable housing, so they keep telling everyone.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Itsme

Agree with you! lets start building High Rise in the burbs

Or, this might be a giant head spin, avoid the cost of high rise buildings and just let people work from home and just connect via teams meeting or zoom…..

A lot of the physical presence required in old analog days just isn’t required unless of course you work in manufacturing which isn’t a big thing in the CBD. The close proximity of businesses in a CBD was all about physical meeting with each other, city hall and government buildings…much of that is now done electronically although there are still deliveries using those cyclists….

[GCRXR6]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Why is our business model still based around an archaic need to group all offices in a central business district?
The day this nonsense goes away is the day we give up a need for so much transport infrastructure and pollution.

Every morning, millions of people heading to a central point full of congestion, that’s just crazy but worse, it’s not necessary, there’s gotta be a better way..

Absolutely. I would also ask why have all GovCo services be based in the capitals. GovCos have, for ages, been yapping about the need for decentralisation. Time for the mutts to stop yapping, and spread the service HQs around the states, and nation.

[Wretched]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Why is our business model still based around an archaic need to group all offices in a central business district?
The day this nonsense goes away is the day we give up a need for so much transport infrastructure and pollution.

Every morning, millions of people heading to a central point full of congestion, that’s just crazy but worse, it’s not necessary, there’s gotta be a better way..

While I do agree to some extent on decentralising, my question is will it do anything at all to ease any transport issues, or will it make it worse?
I work in the CBD and hate having to travel there when i am not working from home, yes, there are times when actual physical presence is required or far easier than on a Teams chat. There is also the fact some people prefer to work in an office. Imagine I (and a whole bunch of others) have to travel all over the state to various offices when most of it could be done in a day or two in one location? Not forgetting it is far easier for the majority to get to a centralised spot than having to travel to numerous locations (if applicable).

I don't think decentralisation alone is the solution; flexible working and decentralising is a way forward. Not having to force anyone to go to an office 5 days a week is a better solution. Most companies have adopted this (there are outliers but that happens) and leave it up to the employees.

That would mean there is less need for more BS office buildings to be built.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Wretched

While I do agree to some extent on decentralising, my question is will it do anything at all to ease any transport issues, or will it make it worse?
I work in the CBD and hate having to travel there when i am not working from home, yes, there are times when actual physical presence is required or far easier than on a Teams chat. There is also the fact some people prefer to work in an office. Imagine I (and a whole bunch of others) have to travel all over the state to various offices when most of it could be done in a day or two in one location? Not forgetting it is far easier for the majority to get to a centralised spot than having to travel to numerous locations (if applicable).

I don't think decentralisation alone is the solution; flexible working and decentralising is a way forward. Not having to force anyone to go to an office 5 days a week is a better solution. Most companies have adopted this (there are outliers but that happens) and leave it up to the employees.

That would mean there is less need for more BS office buildings to be built.

No not intending to eliminate all travel to CBDs but let’s say half of the people were given alternatives, be that flex hours, later starting time hybrid work from home, that would massively improve road congestion.

[.:4:.]

So this is just an observation of mine. When the work from home was in full swing in 2020, i was working as an electrician in office blocks in sydney. Majority of offices only had a couple staff on site. So essential staff aside, the non essentials, most had one of 2 reasons they chose to come into the office every day. One reason was they loved their partner but not 24 hours a day. The other reason was having a routine keeps them motorvated. As in zoom meetings are fine, but a zoom meeting when all you do is chuck on a button up shirt yet are still in your boxers/pajama pants isnt very motorvating.

[jpd80]

As an example, I have a superior who dose similar QA work as myself, quality assurance and checks on equipment and approvals on personnel. If he travels to and from work that’s up to 3 hours lost that he could be doing from his home which is located on the outer northern suburbs of Brisbane. Discussions with management has seen a great improvement in hybrid work where a portion can be done in our office or on site with staff and the rest from home.

When working from home, there are some basic rules for keeping focused and motivated, having a designated office area, getting dressed and starting at agreed times, a routine if you will is a big part of increased efficiency. With our situation it’s easy for managers to view progress on assignments and sorting out technical problems, most being time critical with prompt responses and updates schedules.

Maybe my situation is different to others, I normally work in the office as it’s only about six minutes from home but there are times when two or three days a week from home are quite acceptable but yeah, I like the comradely that goes with the office personnel, not so much when everyone is on away work.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by jpd80

When working from home, there are some basic rules for keeping focused and motivated, having a designated office area, getting dressed and starting at agreed times, a routine if you will is a big part of increased efficiency. With our situation it’s easy for managers to view progress on assignments and sorting out technical problems, most being time critical with prompt responses and updates schedules.

When everyone started working from home, I noticed I was getting responses from people outside of hours - IE wasn't uncommon for a customer to send me an email at 11PM which I thought was a bit strange.

I don't particularly care about getting extended hours from my customers but it was a case of people weren't 'switching off' from work either so they'd still be 'in the office' long outside their regular hours that they werent getting paid from either, it was like their work day extended massively.

[Citroënbender]

They need to use the “save draft” function more. Unless it’s a person I socialise with, or a clearly articulated genuine emergency, I don’t respond out-of-hours to work related stuff.

[sexyxe]

It's going to be a sad day when I have to stop doing all my hobbies because I cant afford to run any of them.

2.40/u98 locally. And in September I am preparing myself to essentially die of shock at the 30c jump that will occur.

My occupation is set on a government fixed 2% year pay rises. For the last 5 years it has sucked to be such a step behind and its only getting worse!

[Sprintey]

Absolutely need to get everyone back into the office 9-5 in the CBD. The surf has been ridiculously crowded. I'm with the business owners and CBD cafe owners on this one.

On topic: saw under $2 in town on Saturday morning.

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by Sprintey

Absolutely need to get everyone back into the office 9-5 in the CBD. The surf has been ridiculously crowded. I'm with the business owners and CBD cafe owners on this one.

On topic: saw under $2 in town on Saturday morning.

I still haven't paid over $2 yet. $1.99 was the worst I have had while filling up.

Based on the prices I have seen lately, I think my luck will run out soon.

[T3rminator]

Big social problems coming if things don't change quickly. This is really sad to see. Have been getting "spammed" almost every other day from Food Bank since making contributions during the pandemic.

Some cars are arriving 3 hours before the stations open. You'd think the charitable feed they recieved will be offset by the fuel usage whilst waiting.

https://twitter.com/9NewsMelb/status...d4NrZT_Kw&s=19

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by T3rminator

Big social problems coming if things don't change quickly. This is really sad to see. Have been getting "spammed" almost every other day from Food Bank since making contributions during the pandemic.

Some cars are arriving 3 hours before the stations open. You'd think the charitable feed they recieved will be offset by the fuel usage whilst waiting.

https://twitter.com/9NewsMelb/status...d4NrZT_Kw&s=19

What do you mean 'coming'? There's been big social problems around Melbourne for the past decade, while it continually hides under 'most liveable city' bull**** title, there's been a HUGE increase in the amount of homeless people calling the CBD home in that time, massive amounts of violent crime in the less affluent outer suburbs that no one seemed to notice until it happened in Brighton.

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

What do you mean 'coming'? There's been big social problems around Melbourne for the past decade, while it continually hides under 'most liveable city' bull**** title, there's been a HUGE increase in the amount of homeless people calling the CBD home in that time, massive amounts of violent crime in the less affluent outer suburbs that no one seemed to notice until it happened in Brighton.

Yep, Melbourne seems to be changing for the worst. we used to visit a bit for the good food but lately not much of a hurry to go there anytime soon.
Sort of lost interest in working in cities.

[mondeomatureguy]

Hi Guys,
The Petrol Crisis is hurting everybody. It cost me $100. dollars to fill up my Mondeo at $2 09 cents a litre for 91.

They say its going to get worse, soon nobody will be able to afford to use there car.

[FTE217]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

What do you mean 'coming'? There's been big social problems around Melbourne for the past decade, while it continually hides under 'most liveable city' bull**** title, there's been a HUGE increase in the amount of homeless people calling the CBD home in that time, massive amounts of violent crime in the less affluent outer suburbs that no one seemed to notice until it happened in Brighton.

Your post does cover alot whats been going on in Melb and many have their heads in the sand down there living in past.....
I have been a regular business traveller there for the last 30yrs.
Got to say it was once miles ahead of messy Sydney of its roads and the general day to day outlook.
Its chip on its shoulder to be the No1 city over Sydney is a crown of thorns that now is giving.
Years ago traffic at peak was way better but the last 10yrs or so its caught up to Sydney hands down, infact at least in Sydney you can speed reasonably without being pinged whereas Melb, well always been the 0 tolerance State.
Sydney's homeless was isolated around the Cross and Woolloomollo Melb now has just as much and wider from my observations.
I was there last week for 2days, what a nightmare to drive around the CBD and close burbs.
The amount of For Lease signs far out weighs Sydney from observations as well.
Another good job there Dan.
Unemployed youth around the city streets makes you very sus walking around some parts.
Heaps of development going on just wonder what future tenants can afford the rentals the way its going talking about fuel costs for one and the ongoing increase's cost of living...........

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by FTE217

Your post does cover alot whats been going on in Melb and many have their heads in the sand down there living in past.....
I have been a regular business traveller there for the last 30yrs.
Got to say it was once miles ahead of messy Sydney of its roads and the general day to day outlook.
Its chip on its shoulder to be the No1 city over Sydney is a crown of thorns that now is giving.
Years ago traffic at peak was way better but the last 10yrs or so its caught up to Sydney hands down, infact at least in Sydney you can speed reasonably without being pinged whereas Melb, well always been the 0 tolerance State.
Sydney's homeless was isolated around the Cross and Woolloomollo Melb now has just as much and wider from my observations.
I was there last week for 2days, what a nightmare to drive around the CBD and close burbs.
The amount of For Lease signs far out weighs Sydney from observations as well.
Another good job there Dan.
Unemployed youth around the city streets makes you very sus walking around some parts.
Heaps of development going on just wonder what future tenants can afford the rentals the way its going talking about fuel costs for one and the ongoing increase's cost of living...........

Basically all that's going to happen is in 15-20 years time is that Melbourne is going to have an outer slum ring of the reffo suburbs where it's all poorly planned out cheap housing and no services where the 'working poor' exist who have various degrees but can't find work in their fields and work in cash in hand service jobs/gig economy and then the nicer inner parts of Melbourne suburbia where the affluent live and you'll just be one or the other while the 'most liveable city' award only considers the inner 5km radius around the CBD conveniently ignoring the huge hobo camp that Flinders Street Station is.

I'm currently out and about right now in one of the new fledgling reffo suburbs

[kypez]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Basically all that's going to happen is in 15-20 years time is that Melbourne is going to have an outer slum ring of the reffo suburbs where it's all poorly planned out cheap housing and no services where the 'working poor' exist who have various degrees but can't find work in their fields and work in cash in hand service jobs/gig economy and then the nicer inner parts of Melbourne suburbia where the affluent live and you'll just be one or the other while the 'most liveable city' award only considers the inner 5km radius around the CBD.

You mean like almost every major city in the world?

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Basically all that's going to happen is in 15-20 years time is that Melbourne is going to have an outer slum ring of the reffo suburbs where it's all poorly planned out cheap housing and no services where the 'working poor' exist who have various degrees but can't find work in their fields and work in cash in hand service jobs/gig economy and then the nicer inner parts of Melbourne suburbia where the affluent live and you'll just be one or the other while the 'most liveable city' award only considers the inner 5km radius around the CBD conveniently ignoring the huge hobo camp that Flinders Street Station is.

I'm currently out and about right now in one of the new fledgling reffo suburbs

You mean just like $ydney.

[Sprintey]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

What do you mean 'coming'? There's been big social problems around Melbourne for the past decade, while it continually hides under 'most liveable city' bull**** title, there's been a HUGE increase in the amount of homeless people calling the CBD home in that time, massive amounts of violent crime in the less affluent outer suburbs that no one seemed to notice until it happened in Brighton.

It's probably the death of what was once a much more egalitarian Australian society, that's what you might be seeing.

What replaces it is what you get everywhere else - the big metropolises and their slums. Postwar Australia was apparently quite 'equal' - 1/4 acre blocks, a Holden or Falcon, mum at home, Dad's single wage provided, suburbia. It was apparently boring, so we swapped it for what we have today.

The most liveable city marketing is bull****, for sure. I try to never go into the city unless I absolutely have no choice (like Gandalf said of Mordor). It was very cool to go to Melbourne back in the 90's (they had TISM after all), but more recently I've had clients say their city has changed and they no longer want to live there + corona = hey presto, big moves of many who can to the regional areas.

[naddis01]

I really don't get the obsession with the petrol price 'crisis'. If you do 15000km/yr @ 13L/100km and the price of fuel goes up by $1/L you will be paying an extra $2000/yr. Are you really going to put your life on hold over an extra $2000? Yeah it sucks paying more and no one wants to pay more than necessary but really...

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by naddis01

I really don't get the obsession with the petrol price 'crisis'. If you do 15000km/yr @ 13L/100km and the price of fuel goes up by $1/L you will be paying an extra $2000/yr. Are you really going to put your life on hold over an extra $2000? Yeah it sucks paying more and no one wants to pay more than necessary but really...

I grew up in a mostly single income family where as a child my old man had to choose between paying the bills, feeding us or putting fuel in his car to get to work, you could have any two but not all three, Mum even made all my clothes when I was little, it was at the point where my mum was working full time but after paying childcare costs for me and my sister they'd only be up $50/week, plus having to leave work early to grab us was a problem for her employer so it wasn't worth her working.

To save as much as he could on fuel and later childcare costs he'd drop me and my sister off to my grandparents place, park his car there and fare evade into work on public transport.

Apparently according to a certain politician who was on multiple six figures, poor people don't drive cars

These days, scenario is much different but there's going to be a lot more in the same scenario my family were in 25 years ago where every little bit counts, $2000 sounds like nothing to most of us but it really hurts to the lower echelon of our society, it also effects the price of the crap you buy in the shops.

Sure there's more government support these days for those down on the bottom of the ladder but it's still not easy.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

I grew up in a mostly single income family where as a child my old man had to choose between paying the bills, feeding us or putting fuel in his car to get to work, you could have any two but not all three, Mum even made all my clothes when I was little, it was at the point where my mum was working full time but after paying childcare costs for me and my sister they'd only be up $50/week, plus having to leave work early to grab us was a problem for her employer so it wasn't worth her working.

To save as much as he could on fuel and later childcare costs he'd drop me and my sister off to my grandparents place, park his car there and fare evade into work on public transport.

Apparently according to a certain politician who was on multiple six figures, poor people don't drive cars

These days, scenario is much different but there's going to be a lot more in the same scenario my family were in 25 years ago where every little bit counts, $2000 sounds like nothing to most of us but it really hurts to the lower echelon of our society, it also effects the price of the crap you buy in the shops.

Sure there's more government support these days for those down on the bottom of the ladder but it's still not easy.

Well said, I came from a single parent background bought up in a housing commission environment, you certainly knew how limited you were with low income and living with hand me downs.
I still pity these people especially with the pensioners these days.

[Tassie f100]

Originally Posted by naddis01

I really don't get the obsession with the petrol price 'crisis'. If you do 15000km/yr @ 13L/100km and the price of fuel goes up by $1/L you will be paying an extra $2000/yr. Are you really going to put your life on hold over an extra $2000? Yeah it sucks paying more and no one wants to pay more than necessary but really...

So I presume prices in Broken Hill shops haven’t gone up like in most other towns and cities.That will be because freight companies that serve the area aren’t affected by fuel price increases

[naddis01]

Originally Posted by Tassie f100

So I presume prices in Broken Hill shops haven’t gone up like in most other towns and cities.That will be because freight companies that serve the area aren’t affected by fuel price increases

Of course they have but that was not my point. I was making the point that I am not going to lose my freedom of travel over a couple of grand. There are plenty of other things most of us can cut back if needed. If you are happy to sit at home to save a couple of grand then that's your choice.

[Tassie f100]

Originally Posted by naddis01

Of course they have but that was not my point. I was making the point that I am not going to lose my freedom of travel over a couple of grand. There are plenty of other things most of us can cut back if needed. If you are happy to sit at home to save a couple of grand then that's your choice.

Problem is in the longer term you don’t just lose a couple of grands worth of travel.Your coffee costs more,groceries cost more as do everything else you need or want to buy, so the $2000 extra fuel cost flows on and quickly becomes $4-5000 extra per year,which may not be a concern to you,but I can assure you that increase in living costs knocks a lot of people around.

[T3rminator]

HUGE discrepancies now in the eastern subs. 98 ranging from $2.1x to $2.7x, and those are major stations only, sometimes spaced only a couple of Ks apart.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by naddis01

I really don't get the obsession with the petrol price 'crisis'. If you do 15000km/yr @ 13L/100km and the price of fuel goes up by $1/L you will be paying an extra $2000/yr. Are you really going to put your life on hold over an extra $2000? Yeah it sucks paying more and no one wants to pay more than necessary but really...

It really depends on your income as there is lots of people out there who don't earn high wages like others.
For me price of fuel was a big concern to me years ago, being a single income family for 30 years; these days it does not hurt anymore since I'm debt free.
Cheers

PS: I use diesel and that is lot dearer than petrol, think this adding to cost of living big time with the transport companies.

[fordomatic]

Originally Posted by naddis01

I really don't get the obsession with the petrol price 'crisis'. If you do 15000km/yr @ 13L/100km and the price of fuel goes up by $1/L you will be paying an extra $2000/yr. Are you really going to put your life on hold over an extra $2000? Yeah it sucks paying more and no one wants to pay more than necessary but really...

You spend $2000 extra on fuel a year for the car you use for work, then your family car that your wife who stays at home, now we are at $4000. Then lets add in that the rents gone up because you cant afford to buy a house and the landlord passes it on to the tennant. Your rent goes up $50 a week, that's $2600 a year, we are at $6600 a year now. Then lets add the cost of living, lets call it a 7.5% rise on your cost of living. Lets say $10,000 extra a year.

Your annual take home single income after tax is $70,000 because your wife doesn't work as your two kids are young. You have about $100 spare a week after expenses. So yes, the fuel rising $2000 a year for a car is massive for some families

I don't know what world you live in mate, but this is the scenario for a lot of aussies right now, doing it tough. I wish that $10,000 of extra living expenses was back in my pocket though, then i could buy another 100 AU's

Edit, this is not my scenario, this is an example. In my friends circle I am seeing lots of sacrifices to living costs so they can afford to eat, keep a roof over their heads and still manage to survive.