Call for psychological tests for young drivers.

[4Vman]

http://www.news.com.au/national/youn...-1225830110160

A LEADING psychologist has called for mandatory testing of young drivers to ensure only those with "mature" brains are granted licences.

Figures show that 19 people have died in NSW this year - three a week - in crashes involving P-plate drivers.

John Reid, of Monash University, told Fairfax newspapers the only way to reduce the number of P-plate fatalities would be to identify young drivers at risk of behaving irresponsibly.

He said brain maturation varies considerably, although it's normally complete between the late teens and mid- to late-20s. Anywhere from five to 70 per cent of young drivers could have immature brains.



Finally some clear sensible thinking on the topic...

[geckoGT]

I actually like the idea. License according to maturity and not chronological age, watch how many of the young people take a big dose of grow up then. Bring it on!

[Falcon Coupe]

This will never happen, it's discriminatory and the testing could flow on to being denied access to a number of issues that require a mature brain.

EG: Job applications, the right to vote and sexual consent to name a few.

(The right to post on a forum)

[ThePistonHead]

I'd be interested to see what 'tests' this psychologist is proposing, and how reliable they would be.

[geckoGT]

It already does for select job applications, eg emergency services, defence force etc and I personally do not see an issue with that if there a requirement for a certain standard in that job.

The right to vote is a different story, everyone gets a choice and that is something that can be dealt with in legislation.

You are right unfortunately, it will never happen but it is a good idea and one I would support. Why do I have to have the safety of my family affected by 17 year olds that believe that they can drive at 200 kph safely because they have experience on the PS3 with damage turned off?

[Franco Cozzo]

Does that mean that someone who is "mentally mature" could start driving as young as 13 if they passed the test?

[shane3]

Driver training, simple! some thing like the John Bowe advanced driver training, as the guy's teaching at the course I did pointed out 95% of people have never had to deal with an out of control car over/under steer, emergency cornering/swerving, or anything faster then 110Km/h, and have only had training on how to get there drivers license

[BIGJB]

Originally Posted by shane3

Driver training, simple! some thing like the John Bowe advanced driver training, as the guy's teaching at the course I did pointed out 95% of people have never had to deal with an out of control car over/under steer, emergency cornering/swerving, or anything faster then 110Km/h, and have only had training on how to get there drivers license

I have to say I don't entirely agree with this.
I have a nephew who was made (by court order) with a few of his mates to do an advanced
driving course a few years ago. At the time I thought thank god it's about time as these
lads were certainaly going to seriously injure themselves or someone else the way they were carrying on.
It kind of backfired on the boys as all it did was make em think they knew everything when
they had finished and could therefore control any situation.
Not saying driver training doesn't have its place as I truely believe it does.
But there is a flip side to the coin.

[Falcon Coupe]

Originally Posted by shane3

Driver training, simple! some thing like the John Bowe advanced driver training, as the guy's teaching at the course I did pointed out 95% of people have never had to deal with an out of control car over/under steer, emergency cornering/swerving, or anything faster then 110Km/h, and have only had training on how to get there drivers license

Driver training whilst helping to acquire skills can also lead to a different problem.
Instead of thinking one is a race driver they "know" it.

There is no simple fix or it would have been implemented long ago.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by Falcon Coupe

This will never happen, it's discriminatory and the testing could flow on to being denied access to a number of issues that require a mature brain.

EG: Job applications, the right to vote and sexual consent to name a few.

(The right to post on a forum)

Given the points you make i think its an awesome idea!!!!!

This is one area that hasnt been explored.. weed out the ones with a propensity to do stupid things and stop penalising everyone who behaves.
The current level of restrictions (driver, passenger, power) are enough to protect the inexperienced and innocent, now they need to limit the one's who arent mature enough to be trusted...

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by shane3

Driver training, simple! some thing like the John Bowe advanced driver training, as the guy's teaching at the course I did pointed out 95% of people have never had to deal with an out of control car over/under steer, emergency cornering/swerving, or anything faster then 110Km/h, and have only had training on how to get there drivers license

This would be one of the last things id suggest, lack of training isnt the issue, bad attitude and behaviour is....

[pottery beige]

Ban car's.. Everyone walk..

[geckoGT]

Originally Posted by T2TE50#134

I have to say I don't entirely agree with this.
I have a nephew who was made (by court order) with a few of his mates to do an advanced
driving course a few years ago. At the time I thought thank god it's about time as these
lads were certainaly going to seriously injure themselves or someone else the way they were carrying on.
It kind of backfired on the boys as all it did was make em think they knew everything when
they had finished and could therefore control any situation.
Not saying driver training doesn't have its place as I truely believe it does.
But there is a flip side to the coin.

It is all too simple to blame everything on training and skills, all of which is absolutely useless without good maturity and attitude.

Yes there are places for better training, but only in conjunction with attitude adjustment. Most serious accidents in young people are not a result of them finding themselves in normal conditions and not having adequate skill, most result from their attitude putting them in situations that the average competent driver could not control.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by geckoGT

It is all too simple to blame everything on training and skills, all of which is absolutely useless without good maturity and attitude.

Yes there are places for better training, but only in conjunction with attitude adjustment. Most serious accidents in young people are not a result of them finding themselves in normal conditions and not having adequate skill, most result from their attitude putting them in situations that the average competent driver could not control.

ABSOLUTELY SPOT ON.

Too many people are in total denial of this simple but completely accurate assesment.

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Does that mean that someone who is "mentally mature" could start driving as young as 13 if they passed the test?

According to their logic, yes.

What a crock of BS. Why not introduce licensing standards similar to those used in Europe. There standards are costly, lenghty and thorough. Not everyone has a gaurantee of getting a drivers license.

The problem with our system is it is so bad it will require a complete overhaul, and an admission by the authorities that previous driver training standards have been non existant. Fancy allowing junior to pick up mum or dad's bad mistakes. Anyone else see what is fundementally flawed with our current system? The road toll is a good indicator something needs to give.

[UNR8D]

right, so they did stupid things before they had to do a driver training course, now they do stupid things after.. look on the realistic side, at least now they have some hope of it not all going pear shaped.

It didnt make me drive faster, or try and drift the first corner after I left training, and I can assure you after taking advanced/performance and defensive driver training its made me alot more alert as a driver, yes more confident and that's what its designed to do but at the same time, its saved me more times than its got me into situations.

I agree to psychological tests for ALL drivers, not just the young as there are plenty of morons who cant drive across all age groups.

[jpd80]

Young people tend to make bad impulse decisions, there is no real form of
legislation that will 100% guarantee that this will not result in a loss of life.
Sadly, all we can do is warn our youth of the danger, minimise some of the
potential risk and pray to God they come home safe....

[FPV+fteT3]

Driver training courses are the answer IMO and there are different courses advanced driver training is different to defensive driver training the latter is more applicable to new drivers and does not teach as much about fast driving as avoiding hazzards and what to do in an emergency situation.
AAMI insurance has a free course in defensive driving for any P plater who has their car or drives their parents car which is insured by them. This should be open to all new drivers and funded by the govt from the massive revenue from speed cameras....... ...yea I know this wont happen as it will cost not raise revenue and all the kids that will die wont be the pollies kids will they.

[Grunter]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

ABSOLUTELY SPOT ON.

Too many people are in total denial of this simple but completely accurate assesment.

As are those that continue to think this is the answer, when history has proven that it is very close to impossible to completely change young peoples attitudes. "Grown ups" have been trying since the dawn of time and yet every young generation are immortal and know better and every old generation thinks it's the poor attitude of young folks today that's the problem.

So I disagree that advanced training is the last thing they need. It should be the absolutely first thing they are taught, in conjunction with imparting the need to have the right attitude, and then licensing should be based on passing tests that prove that they can get out of the crazy stuff they may have put, or find themselves in.

Give them all the skills and training that is possible, so they are more likely get out of a situation their attitude and lack of maturity put them in.

[paule11]

Better of mandatory training in schools from the age of 14 start of with road rules at 14 car simulators at 15 then proper cars at 16.

[4Vman]

You cannot possibly teach a NEW unfamiliar "reactive" skill to be "instinctive" in a single defensive driver course...

Skills learnt on defensive driver courses are rarely remembered or "recruited" in a split second instinctive situation, it takes months of practice for reactive skills to become instinctive and used without thought....

Drivers should not be taking risks first and foremost, not taught to get out of a stupid situation caused by ignoring road laws and acting irresponsibly....

The one factor no driver can control is what other drivers are doing or reacting to what you do, just because you loose control doing something stupid and regain control of your vehicle on a wet road doesn't meant you haven't caused chaos for other road users and caused them to crash...

This "ideology" is selfish and idiotic at best...

[vztrt]

Funny you could have a 'mature' brain for driving but still have no idea what your doing behind the wheel. Ho bout making the driving test harder and longer and not put the emphasis on the simulation rubbish they have now.

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

http://www.news.com.au/national/youn...-1225830110160

A LEADING psychologist has called for mandatory testing of young drivers to ensure only those with "mature" brains are granted licences.

Figures show that 19 people have died in NSW this year - three a week - in crashes involving P-plate drivers.

John Reid, of Monash University, told Fairfax newspapers the only way to reduce the number of P-plate fatalities would be to identify young drivers at risk of behaving irresponsibly.

He said brain maturation varies considerably, although it's normally complete between the late teens and mid- to late-20s. Anywhere from five to 70 per cent of young drivers could have immature brains.



Finally some clear sensible thinking on the topic...

Perhaps we may need to resort to this kind of thing . I am 3 years older than my brother . , by the time he got his p's i'd already been in 2 accidents , i told him to not trust his judgement and ayre on the side of caution, becuase it had already cost me a lot of money , and i'd realised that i could not control a car . He promised me he would . 2 days later i got a call at work , he'd run off the road and hit a tree . No one was injured, 2 of his mates were in the car with him . The car was a total write off . It was at the end of a very long straight suburban street with a turn at the end .
His mates told me that at the end of the street where he started from , my brother said "now lets see what this thing can do" .
He learnt nothing from my experience , as i learnt nothing off others .
Both of us survived our younger years by being lucky.
Perhaps psychology tesing is the way to go beforehand.
cripes - spelling edited

[paule11]

I have my doubts about psychologists and their testing .
Did some aptitude and pschological testing years ago and passed the psychologist said if you fail there is no use resitting as you will never pass.
One guy failed after having any sleep in the last 30 hours due to callouts he had to argue to get a second chance to do it and when they gave in he passed with flying colours.
Also seen apprentices who have passed aptitude and psychological testing which showed they were highly suited to a trade and they were useless drongos.

What will happen when you get a racial minority member who doesnt have a mature brain will they be given a licence out of fear of being called a racist.

[sweetspirit]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

http://www.news.com.au/national/youn...-1225830110160

A LEADING psychologist has called for mandatory testing of young drivers to ensure only those with "mature" brains are granted licences.

Figures show that 19 people have died in NSW this year - three a week - in crashes involving P-plate drivers.

John Reid, of Monash University, told Fairfax newspapers the only way to reduce the number of P-plate fatalities would be to identify young drivers at risk of behaving irresponsibly.

He said brain maturation varies considerably, although it's normally complete between the late teens and mid- to late-20s. Anywhere from five to 70 per cent of young drivers could have immature brains.



Finally some clear sensible thinking on the topic...

It might work but if they have problems ect they might just drive without one .

[flappist]

Two points:

1) None of the incumbent governments will ban driving by stupid or immature people as it would alienate a huge percentage of their electoral support base.

2) The majority of drivers, especially city based, have no idea how to control a car. There is nowhere for them to learn or practice advanced driving techniques other than a tiny number of driving schools for huge fees.

When I was young we used to drive on salt flats, bush dirt roads, mud flats and remote roads like loonies racing, doing slides, donuts and every other stunt we could think of.
This training is a huge benefit when faced with a dangerous situation.
Such things are now called hooning and if anyone were to try it, particularly in the cities, they would be shot, burned, drowned and then locked up forever (or possibly longer) and get their own segment on ACA.

Some time ago I attended a skid pan day with about 20 other AFF members. Watching the skilled driving demonstrations was most illuminating.
Many could not do a single lap of a circle without spinning out even after several attempts.

Why?

Because they cannot practice anywhere for fear of having their car confiscated so the first time they get into trouble they have no idea what to so and it often ends in tragedy.

While we have dogmatic zealots lobbying and advising naive politicians on road safety the road toll will remain (or get worse).

[mik]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

This would be one of the last things id suggest, lack of training isnt the issue, bad attitude and behaviour is....

HERE HERE spot on i reckon, and i`d go further and say the parents should teach these youngens better , but half the problem is the parents are somewhat clueless as well, as for the psychological tests ,we have`nt learned how to stop the common cold yet , how are they going to predict who is going to screw up and who is`nt, the intentions are good, but they try this stuff with prisoners , they get parole and 3 months later they screw up again.

[geckoGT]

Psychological testing weeds out 1000's of unsuitable people that apply for the ambulance, fire and police service each year. You would be surprised what they can tell from about 200 questions.

But then again, I did get through so maybe it does not get it right.

[paule11]

Originally Posted by flappist

Two points:

1) None of the incumbent governments will ban driving by stupid or immature people as it would alienate a huge percentage of their electoral support base.

2) The majority of drivers, especially city based, have no idea how to control a car. There is nowhere for them to learn or practice advanced driving techniques other than a tiny number of driving schools for huge fees.

When I was young we used to drive on salt flats, bush dirt roads, mud flats and remote roads like loonies racing, doing slides, donuts and every other stunt we could think of.
This training is a huge benefit when faced with a dangerous situation.
Such things are now called hooning and if anyone were to try it, particularly in the cities, they would be shot, burned, drowned and then locked up forever (or possibly longer) and get their own segment on ACA.

Some time ago I attended a skid pan day with about 20 other AFF members. Watching the skilled driving demonstrations was most illuminating.
Many could not do a single lap of a circle without spinning out even after several attempts.

Why?

Because they cannot practice anywhere for fear of having their car confiscated so the first time they get into trouble they have no idea what to so and it often ends in tragedy.

While we have dogmatic zealots lobbying and advising naive politicians on road safety the road toll will remain (or get worse).

That sums it all up

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by shane3

Driver training, simple! some thing like the John Bowe advanced driver training, as the guy's teaching at the course I did pointed out 95% of people have never had to deal with an out of control car over/under steer, emergency cornering/swerving, or anything faster then 110Km/h, and have only had training on how to get there drivers license

Most people obey the speed limits and slow down when they can sense a potential hazard,
this is of far more practical use than having people throw cars around and catch slides.
All you do with advanced driver training is give DHs the attitude to think they are better than the rest.

Some of the best drivers I've see never speed and never get near
having an accident because they avoid them in the first place.